1 10 216 https://voicesofignacio.cvlcollections.org/files/original/17b9951c6baea3ec76b0d39f5df501c7.pdf 6566efc2482fbcb0af3ca79806db3541 PDF Text Text ------ - - - - - - Norman C. Wright (Abridged) I was born in Red Wing, CO, probably southwest of Pueblo 35 miles. I was born there and stayed there until 1937; I was born in 1915. I grew up right around Rye, CO and Rattlesnake Buttes (that's well-named, because there were a lot of rattlesnakes there). My dad homesteaded. He must have homesteaded about 1910. At that time he was a forest ranger. I started school in Rattlesnake Buttes. We left Rattlesnake Buttes and went to Avondale, CO when I was a seventh grader, and we stayed there for five years. Then we went back to Rye, CO. We left Rye in the fall of 1937. My cousin and I came across here on horseback; we drove a bunch of horses. We were raising draft horses, at that time, and were selling teams of horses. My cousin Ralph Brier and I, we were over that pass ... what's the name of that pass? Anyway, the first day we got into the horse trade and traded until we were broke. We stopped and slept in a haystack that night, in Gardner, CO. The next day we went over Musket Pass. We probably had 40 head of horses: colts, mares, and broken horses, saddle horses We came over right above the sand dunes in the San Luis Valley. We stayed there the third night at a ranch, came on through to Alamosa, and stayed the fourth night in Alamosa. Then, one day, my dad started and brought seven milk cows alone to drive with the horses. I just blew my stack Well, the cows went dry on the way over here. We were going to this place over here on the Florida River; it was called the CJ Bar Ranch at that time. We stayed there, let's see, about five years. Then we went back to Pagosa, and I stayed there 18 years. I came down here 46 years ago this fall [2004]. That's all my time. I was all breaking horses, and I never had a tractor until I was 25 years old. They never had any. Tractors didn't come out until after World War II. I bought two little tractors; I thought I would get two. And, I thought it would take them what a horse could do, but they did what four horses could do. So it will be 46 years since I came here this November and I've been here ever since. I bought this place here in 1960 (I had leased it). I have this territory: about 800 acres ... lots of walking, lots of irrigating. I had registered cattle here, registered Herefords. I stayed in that and I had some good bulls, but then the exotic bulls started coming in, the foreign bulls, and we couldn't compete against them. Now we cross breed them [Herefords] with black cattle, and that's a disgrace to me but you have to do it. That's what the people, as well as what the feedlots want. My father was John Washington Wright, and he was born and raised in Wentmore, CO. My mother's maiden name was Ethel Lois Churchill. (My middle name is Churchill, and I am a fourth cousin of Winston Churchill.) She was raised in Wisconsin. She came to Colorado and got her degree to teach at the teachers' school in Wentmore; where she and my dad met. My father was a forest ranger, then he homesteaded a place southeast of Walsenburg out in the dry land around Rattlesnake Buttes. It seemed like I was there forever. But, it was well named: lots of rattlesnakes. We lost three wean-er colts (suckling colts). They are quite inquisitive and they see something. An old horse knows the buzzing of that tail, the rattling, like a person and it will just scare you to death. But the colts, they don't know yet, they're real inquisitive and they'll go sniffing around. Killed three of them. �Page 2 of 4 I have been in the cattle business all my life. I tried shearing sheep here on this place once, but coyotes ... coyotes and dogs. So, one year I got rid of them [the sheep] and got my cattle back. We had a permit, east of Bayfield, for about 1,200 acres. We had 226 head of horse, and I sold that ranch. I sold it because I was hard up: couldn't make ends meet. It wasn't much. You couldn't raise a calf for what you'd get out of it. So, I stayed here and had a chance to sell that place up there for a crazy number: a million and a half [dollars]. That seems crazy, don't it? That was in ... right recently ... about 1998, something like that. I was able to pay back some old debts, but I still wanted to raise cattle. I gave half of the ranch to my youngest son, and this half I've kept after and I will give over to my two grandsons (they're both grown men, now). I also have a great-grandson. Four generations on this ranch, the Wright Ranch. It's still known as the Spanish Forks Ranch, because that's what it was when I bought it. The name came from a man that lived in Spanish Forks, Utah. He loaned money on this place some way or another and foreclosed on it. So, he called it the Spanish Forks Ranch and that was in the 1920s. I have two sons. I had a daughter, but she passed away. My oldest son lives in New Mexico, just on the other side of the line. And, Wayne, my other son, lives here. My oldest son has been more into construction. He's living down here, and he had a heart attack about four years ago. He's getting old too, you know. I'll be 89 this fall, and I feel like a kid. I can't walk; I get to where my legs give out. You've got to have a good spirit. It's kept me going from the times when I thought I was going to lose everything. I believe in the Lord, and I trust in the Lord to see me out just as he saw me in. My mother was a Baptist. My father was a Presbyterian. So, I'm a Baptist now, and there're a lot of differences among Baptists. In 1939, I married and went on my own. But, in 1942 I lost her (she passed away), so I went back home in Pagosa for two or three years. Then, I married a girl and we lived together until she passed away. Then, I met this gal and we've lived together for the past ten years, almost eleven. She's my third wife. Third time's a charm. But, I had to get married both times ... I sold mostly wean-er stock. I sold the weaning calves off of the cows, generally. Somebody else put them in a feedlot. My cattle always did good in the feedlot. I went for the stretch-ier type of beef, rougher type cattle. My dad was more of a smooth, pretty yellow [cattle] feller. But, I thought a Hereford was supposed to be good and wide, so I bred them to be good and wide. Some of the Herefords went to a pretty yellow-red, and they went smaller and smaller. A 1,200-pound bull would be a mature bull. I have cows that are 1,200 pounds. The bulls I used as sires I bought out of Canada, and those are big type cattle, good-doing cattle. They could stand bad weather and everything. So, I had a man in Washington who I bought the bulls through. The Anxiety Fourth was a bull, purebred breeder out in Hereford. But, they went for the short-type. The first Anxiety Fourth were good cattle, but the breeders kept getting them pretty and yellow, and fat and easy. But we don't want fat ... we want muscle. That's how I built cattle: with muscle gain and not fat gain. You don't want fat, because you throw it away. That's what the cattle are today. The Limousine and Charle are both French cattle, and that's what they went for. The Americans learned from those breeders in foreign countries that you've got to raise �Page 3 of 4 muscle instead of fat. The muscle is what you eat and what's good for you. The fat you supposed to throw away. The feedlots are mostly in eastern Colorado, and down through the Arkansas Valley there are lots of feedlots. But my cattle, well it depended on who bought them. A man in Pagosa bought mine and would sell them to the feedlot. They gained 3 1/10 pounds per day on grass all summer long. So, he bought my steers, but he wanted to get them smaller. He put less into them, but we still raised good cattle. We've had to sell off our cattle: two years ago there was not feed in this country, and you couldn't afford to ship it in; it made it too high. The government finally brought it to Alamosa, but that cost us $25 a ton to get it here besides what it already cost. So, that didn't go over very big. Now, the cattle are going out more and they're going to the feedlots. There are not many fed around here: the winters are too bad for them. Down towards Farmington, there's a feedlot or two. Some of them learned that one of the real secrets of raising tender meat is to butcher cattle when ... If they're in a storm, they're going to be tough. That meat is going to be a little tougher than if the weather is good. *** I can remember when I was first going to school. .. the first day of school with my sister. We rode horses there; you didn't dare walk on account of the prairie wolves. The prairie wolf is a smaller wolf than the timber wolf, but they're just as vicious. I remember when I hadn't even gone to school yet, my uncle had trapped one and it broke away from the trap. He and my dad tracked it and I got to go along with them on a horse beside them. I could just barely hold on to the horse. They finally come to it and shot him, and I went over and picked up his tail. It went, "Grrrruff." They said I went and jumped up on my horse. It scared me half to death, and I was about 6 years old (first grader). But, we tracked him. I was on a horse myself; he had a small horse. I learned to ride when I was about five years old ... five or six years old. I learned to ride a horse when I went to school (I started when I was five years old, six that October). It was a one-room schoolhouse. It's still there. My wife and I drove over there, I was writing the story of my life, and I wanted to show her some of those places. That schoolhouse is still standing. That was about three or four years ago. It is in Rattlesnake Buttes. There's a South Rattlesnake Butte and North Rattlesnake Butte. This is North Rattlesnake Butte, near where the post office was. But at the other one, there were rattlesnakes ... they were everywhere. Kids learned to stay out of the brush or anything. My dad homesteaded two canyons close in, but it was right next to the prairie. We had two horses when we came here; we left in the fall of '37. My cousin and I rode; we came over the top of Musket Pass. We couldn't go over Wolf Creek, because Wolf Creek was closed then (they were building a new road). So, we had to go over to Cumbres Pass; which is over here down in New Mexico. We got as far as Ananeda and we heard of a bad storm on the Pass, so my dad put me, the horses and the seven old milk cows on the train. I came over the rest of the way through Lumberton, NM back up right over by the river here, the Pine River (there were some �Page 4 of 4 loading pens there). They got there at 1:00 in the morning, and all day that day and through the next night (it was two days travel by train from way down in New Mexico) I unloaded them here. I got them off the train and got them in a pasture from a farmer/rancher where I stayed one night. The next day I drove them across the Florida River going to the top (as if you were going to Durango). At that time it was all sagebrush; there weren't no farmers and ranchers across there. I drove them hungry cows and horses from early in the morning to 4:00 in the afternoon, and I had just one sandwich to eat that morning. I was hungry when I got there, so there were real nice people, who we were going to lease the place from, and I overate ... I got sick. I puked all over the place. I was so embarrassed. They didn't milk the cows the next night, but they were dry ... the cows went dry. I had tried to talk to my dad that they would all go dry, and they were dry. They just couldn't stand that rough abuse. Ranch cows could have, but milk cows can't stand that abuse. So, I had seven milk cows and about 35 or 40 head of horses, and they wouldn't drive together. I didn't have a dog; I had two horses. I left one horse where I could get a hold of him, and I wore two horses riding them, getting them things to not go anywhere else. They would scatter our, and I couldn't keep them together. I was by myself then; my cousin went back with my dad to get stuff and bring it on over here. That was in the fall of 1937: I would have been 22 that fall. I was 22 when I got there, and I felt as though I was 122. We had that place, I think it was, for five years. Then it sold, Land Management sold it and we could not raise the money. We had so much to do on that place. We were intending to buy it, but a rich guy down in Texas wanted to put his money somewhere, so he blew us out. Dad went back to Pagosa, and I went one year above Durango. I went back to Pagosa, but I couldn't find a place to lease, and I had a few stock and I had to find a place. So, I went there and stayed there, then I came down here. It's been 46 years I've been right here this fall. Well, I bought this place in 1960 and that place up there in '66. There's four generations on it [Spanish Forks Ranch] right now and they ought to last a while. Nathan, my oldest grandson is living up there [northern part of ranch], and he has my great-grandson, who's a little over a year old now. He's the cutest little thing I ever saw. He's got grandpa wrapped around his finger. The two grandsons are going to help Wayne, and they're all going to run it together. Interviewed by Michael G. Miller (VISTA worker) on March 5, 2004 at Spanish Forks Ranch, County Road 322. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Michael Miller Interviews Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/CNE/1.0/ Date Created Date of creation of the resource. 2003-2004 Subject The topic of the resource Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Description An account of the resource Collection of twelve biographies written by VISTA worker Michael G. Miller of prominent people in the Ignacio community. Based on interviews conducted by Miller between December 9, 2003 and March 15, 2004. Some contain the additional attribution "for the Ignacio Historical Society." Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Miller, Michael G. Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Norman Wright Biography Date Created Date of creation of the resource. 2004-03-05 Subject The topic of the resource Wright, Norman; Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Description An account of the resource Biography of Norman Wright written by VISTA worker Michael Miller and based on an interview conducted by Miller on March 5, 2004. Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Wright, Norman Extent The size or duration of the resource. 4 pages https://voicesofignacio.cvlcollections.org/files/original/bbc6cc8155e464c5f9dcc8e68b1791b1.pdf 43de4c87ca2cdf6c90d7bdd8ecc4ad9b PDF Text Text Tom Wiseman (Abridged) My full name is William Thomas Wiseman. I was born in Durango at Mercy Hospital in November 1930. My mother was Margaret Summers Wiseman; her maiden name was Bowman. Her father, Thomas E. Bowman, came over Stony Pass into Silverton in 1874. He was a young Civil War veteran, and a recent graduate of the University of Wisconsin in metallurgy. He had acquired a job as a teacher at Colorado College, but coming west he had become interested in the gold fever. He became associated with the people named Greene, who brought the first smelter into Silverton, CO. He was later on the Town Board in Silverton, and later on after many years moved to Durango when the Silverton smelter became less efficient. He married my grandmother, Etta Louisa Bowman, in 1881 I believe it was. He was 20 years older than she. They later had a son named William Bowman and a daughter named Lena Bowman in 1891 and 1894. And then my mother, a late life child, came along surprisingly in 1905. So, that accounts for me, at my tender age of 73, having a grandfather who was in the Civil War and not a greatgrandfather. He passed away about seven years before I was born, so I never got to know him although I know a lot about him. My father was born in Pagosa Junction, CO; where his father in 1904 was working for the railroad. Apparently the family was living there while he worked construction, and previously my grandfather had homesteaded far southeast of Bayfield on what is now called New Creek. Later, after my dad's parents divorced, he, his brother Barney and my grandmother Lula moved to Durango; where my dad went to work at the age of 14. After her finishing the eighth grade in Bayfield schools, my mom and he met in Durango and married in 1927. Having worked in several different areas in Durango, he was at this time working at a firm called the Durango Hardware Company; which was located on the 900 block of Main in Durango. He became acquainted with a wholesale hardware salesman, who told him about an opportunity to manage a store in Ignacio. The store being named HC. Biggs and Company; which was a hardware, lumber, farm implement and feed dealer at the time. Dad must have been only 25 or something at the time, so he came out here, stayed at the local commercial hotel, and worked for Mr. Biggs for some time. A few months later, he moved his family to Ignacio. The Biggs family moved to Grand Junction at this time. So, I was two years old when we moved to Ignacio. I virtually grew up in the hardware store. Much of my time off was spent there- it seemed to be a fun place to be. Later on, went to school here in Ignacio through the ninth grade. At this time and in previous years, kids from Ignacio went to Durango to finish high school. And, at this time, in the late 40s, had lost its accreditation: due to the war the enrollment at the school was very, very low. I graduated from Durango High School in 1948, entered the University of Denver that Fall, and graduated from there in 1952. When I first went to Denver, to school, I felt that I really wanted to get into the big time, was not much interested in coming back to this part of the country. At that time, most kids my age kind of wanted to leave the area for bigger opportunities. But, most of my acquaintances at �Page 2 of6 Denver University were older than I. They were mostly World War II veterans. They seemed to be delighted in the mountains, the scenery. Most of them were from back East and the Midwest. After a year or two I started looking around and thinking more carefully that I had mountains out my front door window everyday. I slowly realized that this was my home and would be so. In 1954, while working with my father (by all this time through school and after school), I met and married a girl from Bayfield named Beverly Moberly. We had three children: Gretchen, born in 1956; Loretta, born in 1957; and Larry, born in 1959. Throughout all of these years I was active in all conceivable local service organizations: Kiwanis Clubs, Lions Clubs, various committees with the Southern Ute Tribe, I was involved on the Town Board through several contentious years as a board member and mayor pro tern. I was involved in things like trying to save the old Ignacio Chieftain newspaper. I have always been hopeful that somehow a museum could be built in this area to commemorate the unusual history of this young, strangely versatile town. In 1976 my father died, in 1979 my mother died. In the meantime, in 1968, I had purchased the entirety of the hardware store from my dad, and he retired happily after that. But, he did work some in the hardware store at his and my convenience and desire-we were always good friends, the best. In 1981-82, I divorced my wife. She moved to Durango, the kids by this time were all over the age of 21 and were scattered throughout the country. Six years later, I went to a high school class reunion, where I re-met my old girl that I had dated in high school named Paula. We married in 1988. She is practically a Durango native, at least she's a Colorado native (having been born in Durango). I don't consider myself to be such an unusual character, but boy have I met a lot of them. The pioneers of this town are underreported I believe. For example, Hans Aspas; who as an infant (aged one and a half years), was carried by his mother over Stony Pass into Silverton at about the same time that my grandfather arrived there. His father had been an officer in the Norwegian army. Harold Payne and many of the old, old timers that I didn't know, but who were terrific strong, solid people. Joe Velasquez, many, many Southern Utes- Julius Cloud, Julian Baker- we're all acquaintances. Did business with them, was friends with them. To many it would have been an uneventful life; to me it's very colorful. My children love this area. They have mixed emotions about their childhood, but as they grow and mature I think they realize their acquaintance the Southern Ute tribal members, the Navajo tribal members whom they went to school with when the schools were integrated (the public schools and the Indian school). They're Spanish-American friends have given them a broad diversity, an understanding and comfort with, I believe, other races and people of other beliefs and values. *** I've essentially lived on this street all my life. When we first moved to Ignacio, the Biggs house; which is on the 500 block of Browning Ave. (where Jesse Hott now lives), was our house until 1935 when my father bought the little house across the street here [455 Browning Ave.]; which at one time was 470 Browning Ave. Then, after I married, I bought the house two doors north on that side of the street [east side]; which at that time was 440 Browning Ave. �Page 3 of6 In 1977 or '78, the house where I live now, presently, (455 Browning Ave.) came up for sale and I bought it, having always enjoyed and liked the house. We spent a great deal of money overhauling, remodeling, and adding rooms upstairs to the house. This house was built by the person who owned the local lumberyard; which was at that time known as Ignacio Lumber Co. Circa 1916 or '17, it was sold to the Biggs family, who were part ofa big lumber operation out of Chama, and also with family connections in Grand Junction. The store was owned and operated by Homer Biggs- Homer C. Biggs (the 'C.' stands for Copeland, I believe). They had three children, one of whom was named Homer Biggs, Jr. They went to school here. The Historical Society now has pictures, early class pictures, including 'Joe' Biggs- his nickname was 'Joe' to his family. He later, during the early part of World War II, left Colorado College and became an Army Air Force cadet. He learned to fly in Phoenix, at Luke Field I believe it was. Went into B-17 training. In May of 1943, his bomber was shot down over France and he did not survive. Among other tons of pictures that I have, I have a picture of that flight crew. I'm deeply interested in the success of the Historical Society. And, I hope that somehow, someday a facility can be acquired, or participated in, where so many pictures and records of archives can be safely preserved for the future. This community has always been a rather cosmopolitan community, because of the original Bureau of Indian Affairs/Dept. of the Interior school system here mainly for Navajo kids. The school existed from what must have been the 1920s to about 1970. The many oil and gas interests that have had staff located here, the wide diversity of teaching talent, there's been quite a variety from all over the country. My own background, for example: My grandfather (my mother's father) came from Wisconsin-born there a year and half after his mother migrated from England to Wisconsin. Her mother [Tom's mother's mother], Edna Louis Bowman, was born in Ohio, and came out here to stay with an elder sister; who was married to a Methodist minister in Durango, in the 1880' s. My father's father came out here from North Carolina, from the mountains of NC to homestead. And his wife, my grandmother, also came from the mountains of North Carolina. So, we have our own eastern 'roots'. I was an only child. There were two other attempts: one before me and one after me, both were unsuccessful. My mother was born on December 1905 at home in Durango at 760 3rd Avenue. The house is still there. It's for sale. You could snab it up for about $450,000, I think, right now. My grandfather Bowman owned quite a bit of property in Durango at one time. The Silver Panic of 1892-93 apparently put him on his 'uppers' for several years, but he did open a bookshop and a stationary store circa 760 Main Ave. (in the same building that is the Seasons Restaurant today). I have pictures of it, and it still has the same ceiling I think. He ran that store until he died in 1923. He died during his lunch hour at home. I've learned more about my grandfather, T.E. Bowman, from books written by Allen Nossaman; who wrote an incredible history of Silverton, CO. Allen has come to this house. I've furnished him with pictures of my granddad. His three volumes that he's published so far on Silverton are extremely detailed. Much is derived from newspapers and courthouse records, land records and family photographs. And, I think I know more about my grandfather's history than my mother did through the efforts of Allen Nossaman. My grandfather, he was in the Civil War. He was very young, of course: he was born in 1846 and the war started in '61. He enlisted in 1864, in the spring, with a volunteer Wisconsin �Page 4 of6 infantry battalion. He was underage. He allegedly lied about his age and said he was over 16. He eased his conscience by writing on a piece of paper that he was 16 putting it in his shoe, and swearing that he was 16. I have pictures of him in his uniform, which was way too large. But, he served as a drummer boy. At the end of his enlistment he reenlisted in an artillery outfit in late '64. He served primarily around Washington, D.C. I don't think he was in any major battles. But he was a member of the Durango chapter of the Grand Army of the Republic-the G.A.R. I think he was one of the founding officers of it. When he died, my grandmother applied for and received a Civil War pension. It wasn't very much, maybe $12 a month or something like that. After getting out of the Army he literally had to be adopted by an uncle named 'Bowman'. My grandfather's birth name was Thomas Merritt Dibley. Now, 'Dibley' somehow disappeared from the picture, and left my granddad's mother's side. In his early life he married a girl named Josephine Standish in Wisconsin; who is purported to be a relative of Miles Standish. They moved to Silverton. She taught school there. They spent some winters in Denver, some time in Denver. This was after the train was completed, and in those days it was not hard to get to Denver: grab the train in Silverton to Durango, through Ignacio, Pagosa, Chama, Alamosa, and onto the main standard gauge up to Denver. So, people got around a lot more quickly than people realize. She caught Scarlet Fever in Denver, and died I believe on Christmas Day circa 1889. He buried her in the Riverside Cemetery in Denver; which at that time was quite a nice cemetery at that time. She's buried about 30 ft. from Augusta Taber (who was the first wife ofH.A.W. Taber-one of the silver kings of CO). Strangely when she died, my grandfather bought four cemetery plots. I have the deed for them today, and I'm guessing that they're still valid. In case anyone needs cemetery plots in Riverside Cemetery, I can furnish three more. After moving to Durango, he was in the First Baptist Church he and my grandmother, I think, met at some choir function around 1890. Her name was Etta Louisa Summers. He was the master of the local Masonic Lodge #46; he was about the eighth master of that lodge. My grandfather Wiseman, on the other hand, moved to Denver after his divorce. Built a house there and worked for the railroad as a master carpenter. He worked in D. & R. G. [Denver and Rio Grande] shops for the rest of his life. He died in 1945. I went deer hunting with him once. Two or three months before he died he was down here visiting us. We have since visited some of our 'roots' in North Carolina. My father worked for H.C. Biggs and Company here in Ignacio. Later, in 1940, he bought out a fourth of it, and in 1950 bought the rest of it. He changed the name to 'Wiseman Hardware and Lumber Co.', and that's what it remained until I sold it to Glenn Walker in 1992. Walker subsequently changed it to 'Walker's True Value', and moved down south of town and built a new hardware store. *** The reason my grandmother [Etta Louisa] came to CO was that her older sister (Kate Summers) was living in Durango. Her husband was a Methodist minister. My grandmother had �Page 5 of6 become enchanted with a musician in Shelby, Ohio. Her father [Daniel B. Summers] wanted to get her out of that influence, and so decided to send her to CO. *** I studied Business Administration at the University of Denver. BS/BA I think is what my degree said: Bachelor of Science in Business Administration. We sold everything except groceries: tractors, mowing machines, washing machines, various name brands, sold all. *** My oldest daughter is married to David Germer, whom she met at school in Denver. They were married in 1976. He was a graduate of Colorado School of Mines. He had come :from Pennsylvania to go to school at Mines, took a look at the mountains and never looked back. His career took them to Alaska, where they've lived for about 15 years. My other daughter (my middle child, my youngest daughter), Loretta, married a fellow from Florence, CO whom she met at school in Canyon City. He graduated from UNC (University of Northern Colorado at Fort Collins) as a mechanical engineer, and now works at power plant operations in Wyoming. Neither grandchild grew up here [in Ignacio], and none of the four [grandchildren] has spent much time here. *** Lots and lots of stories, good heavens. The people I have known here, in Ignacio, are some of the most colorful. Some of the stories ... For example, the young lady in the late 30s who was a teacher here, and who married a young man a southern town in CO. He went off to war, she moved to California during the early part of the war with their child. She met a fellow named Gimbal, and the rest is history. She sent off a 'Dear John' letter to her husband, and said Mr. Gimbal is the light of my life. (Of course, his $60 million bank account helped.) Little stories like that. Stories of making the movie Around the World in 80 Days [in Ignacio] ... fascinating. Some of the Historical Society's photos now show some of that filming done. Paul Harvey doing his great radio show from here-a lot of people don't even know that ever happened. That in itself could fill at least four chapters in a local history book. *** M.M.: "What are your views on the current [presidential] administration, and our actions in Iraq?" T.W.: "I think that we're doing exactly the right thing. Those who don't remember World War II, and I wasn't in it (I was too young, I was 11 when Pearl Harbor happened), forget a fellow named Neville Chamberlain who was trying to make peace with Hitler. He said, after meeting with Hitler and before Hitler invaded Poland, 'Peace in our time, to Hitler marches all.' They forget what was not done to stop the Nazis, during WW II, from slaughtering for their [the Jews'] teeth, for their fillings in their teeth. We forget that we were the ones who said, 'Damn the torpedoes!' a couple hundred years ago. Or, the �Page 6 of6 people who said, during WW II, 'Praise the Lord, and pass the ammunition!' We're the ones who sent 20 year olds over to England to fly bombers in WW II, and now most 20 year olds couldn't find the bathroom if you didn't hold their hand to it, in my personal estimation. Am I bitter? Yeah. Angry? Yeah." M.M.: "What are you bitter about?" T.W.: "I'm bitter about these people that don't realize how many of their parents and grandparents, previous generations, who fought and died and killed so that they could spend the last 20-30 years lofting along having no problems at all, except to complain about the price of cigarettes. *** Calvin Coolidge, who was president in the late 20s, said, 'the business of America is business.' Doesn't that sound terrible [sarcastically]? That which makes profits and things like that? You know, 'profits' is not a four-letter word, surprisingly. But, look at what has happened in China. 20 years ago, in the streets of China, all you would have seen were padded olive drab uniforms walking around with glassy eyes. Now, after the cold-hearted glance of capitalism started to show, and the individual is able now to see that he came make himself and his family more comfortable, healthier, is happy. It's even happening in Vietnam. Business: the horrible word [said sarcastically]. Interviewed by Michael G. Miller, VISTA volunteer, for the Ignacio Historical Society. December 18, 2003 � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Michael Miller Interviews Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/CNE/1.0/ Date Created Date of creation of the resource. 2003-2004 Subject The topic of the resource Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Description An account of the resource Collection of twelve biographies written by VISTA worker Michael G. Miller of prominent people in the Ignacio community. Based on interviews conducted by Miller between December 9, 2003 and March 15, 2004. Some contain the additional attribution "for the Ignacio Historical Society." Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Miller, Michael G. Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Tom Wiseman Biography Date Created Date of creation of the resource. 2003-12-18 Subject The topic of the resource Wiseman, Tom; Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Description An account of the resource Biography of Tom Wiseman written by VISTA worker Michael Miller and based on an interview conducted by Miller on December 18, 2003. Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Wiseman, Tom Extent The size or duration of the resource. 6 pages https://voicesofignacio.cvlcollections.org/files/original/e14e14edfb22871f56916380bf8cb06e.pdf 2105be8e535755314dfc28d91ec87934 PDF Text Text Ethel Smith I was born in Collbran, CO, Mesa County, September 1i 11, 1908. I went to a country school, one room school, and then I road three miles horseback to high school. And, I graduated from Collbran Union High School in 1926. [After high school] I started in school in Gunnison, CO, and I went five and half weeks. I road on the train from Grand Junction to Montrose, and then on to Gunnison. I was homesick at the end of one semester, so I went back to Grand Junction, and then on to Collbran in the fall. My parents sold their property and we moved to Missouri. I went to school at Missouri Teachers' College in Springfield, MO. My friend came down from Collbran to MO. In the spring we decided to quit school and go to Marysville to pick strawberries. We found out from the school that they needed teachers. So, we decided to take the teachers' exam. The last exam was on MO history-I looked at her [my friend] and she looked at me, and we got up and walked out. My folks came back to Collbran, after a year in MO. I took the CO state teachers' exam, and taught my first school north ofDebeque, CO. Then, the next year I went to Hayden and taught at a rural school on a cattle ranch. That's where I met my cowboy boyfriend. We were married in 1931. I taught at rural schools, here and there, for the next eight years. Then I taught my last year of school in Uravan. My husband was working in the mines down in Arizona, and our son was 18 months old. So I went down to AZ, and we lived there until 1944. In 1944, we traded our house in AZ for a ranch southeast ofBayfield, CO. My husband was in a later draft [for WWII], but he was "frozen" in the mines. He worked in the copper mines in Jerome, AZ. If you worked in that big copper mine, you were "frozen" [from the draft]. When we moved to CO, then he had to get an agricultural status or he would have been drafted. In the fall [of 1944 ?], somebody had heard that I had taught school. And, so, the school board came up and wanted to know if I wanted to teach at the Pink school, which was about two miles south of our ranch. My son was in the fourth grade [at that time]. I taught there for two years. Stuck in the mud, rode horse back. .. I taught all grades, one through eight. One of my students, who was in the fifth grade, sent me some pictures. I had one picture from when I taught there (from '44-' 45 and '45-' 46). She sent me some pictures, because she went to school there in '41-'42 and '42-'43. Then, I went to Bayfield. There [in Bayfield] I had the seventh grade. Then they unified the districts, and the students started corning in on buses from out towards Pagosa Springs. I had the seventh grade for two years upstairs in the old Bayfield building. When the gym was finished there were two rooms above it. So, I taught over the gym for nine years. You know, the kids never paid any attention to the noise, and I never paid any attention to the noise. There were basketballs-Bang, Bang, music downstairs (under the two rooms), but I don't think anyone ever said anything about the noise. �I did go to Mesa College in Grand Junction one semester, when we came back from MO. So, I had no college credits you might say. College teachers came from University of CO, CO State University, from Western State, from Adams State. There were classes at Fort Lewis [College], and I just started taking classes. So, in 1957 I had a degree: BA degree. They paid $1,000 more in Ignacio, and we were still on the ranch. So, it was about halfway between Ignacio and Bayfield, and I came to Ignacio. And, do you know the story about Benjamin Franklin paying too much for his whistle? Well, I paid too much for my whistle when I came to Ignacio [to teach]. It was the second year that Ignacio schools had been consolidated, and the buses had started to bring the kids in. At the end of the first week I told my husband I wasn't going back. I told the principal that I was not going back. I had one raunchy class: over age Spanish kids. They had been retained in the first grade, they had probably been retained in the third or fourth. At the junior high up here, if you failed two classes, then you were retained in that grade. I had Spanish kids (junior high) sixteen, seventeen, eighteen years old. Five teachers had resigned the year before. So, I told the principal, "I'm not coming back Monday," and he said, "Oh yes you are!" So, I went back on Monday, and a Mr. Ackerd from MO met me at the door. He said, "I'm taking that raunchy class of yours upstairs, and I'm sending you ninth graders that don't know enough to tie their shoes and come to school. You won't have any trouble with them." And, I had a tough principal, I'll tell you, a tough principal. I was in junior high [in Ignacio] until 1961. I saw a bulletin in the teachers' room that said there was an institute over at the University of Nebraska in Guidance and Counseling. I had no idea what it was all about. But, I applied for it, and I had told the superintendent that I had applied for it. And, he said, "Well, go ahead and apply for it, but you won't get it." That [the institute] was for second semester. I applied for it and was accepted. I called him [the superintendent] and told him I was accepted, and he said, "You can't go unless you get somebody to take your place." I was teaching math in seventh, eighth, and ninth grades. Jake Candeleria, who owns Candeleria Heights up here, went to high school with my son. He came up and said that he had just finished college at Adams State, and was wondering where Larry [Ethel's son] was. I told him that he was working over in Mancos, and Jack said that he was desperately in need of a job. He said, "I'm so angry with Mr. Powell (the superintendent). I went down to talk with him, and he said that he didn't have any job for me." I said to Mr. Candeleria, "Well, what's your major?" He said, "Math." So, I let him have my job so that I could go to the institute in Nebraska. That was in '61, and the institute didn't start until February. I was on my way the last day of January, and we didn't get out 'til the last of June. When I came back, Mr. Powell gave me the job to start a guidance program. After Sputnik, these institutes were set up by the government in science and math. After that ran the gamut, they thought that all of these people needed guidance and counseling. So, the government started these guidance and counseling institutes, and �they paid us $7 5 per week. I had no more idea of what I was doing than the man on the moon. But, I started the [guidance] program in elementary clear on through high school. Then I was high school counselor. The most that I did was to find out where money came from for kids to go on to school. And, I worked a lot with minority students. I worked with the Indian students a lot. Mr. Dietz, the superintendent at the time, called me and said that Mr. Scott was going to take the Indian students, he was to be my cocounselor and he would take the Indian kids. Mr. Dietz told me to set up meetings with the students and find out who wants to go to Mr. Scott; who was Navajo married to a Ute. He never got an Indian kid, I got all the Indians and he got all the white kids. I would say to them, "why don't you go to Mr. Scott?" They replied, "we don't want to work with an Indian." I retired in '74. I have belonged for many years to Delta Kappa Gamma, an international teachers' organization. They send out a bulletin, and in one bulletin they advertised for a social studies and English teacher at Navajo Community College. You know, I didn't even know what a resume was. You never heard of the word "resume". So, I sent an application in, but they hired a teacher from Canada who had had ESL [English as a Second Language training]. In two years, shwe decided to go back to Canada, anfd the chairperson at the college asked me to come for an interview. I was substituting at the high school [at the time], so I didn't go [for the interview] until spring vacation. I was hired, and was there for 20 years. Well, I'm 95 now and I stayed there 'til I was 88, I'll let you do your math. I came home every two weeks for 20 years. And, you know, I never thought anything about the roads, I never had a flat tire-I couldn't have changed it ifI did. I had my first one up here about two months ago. I have the one son, and he left school when he was a junior and went into the Navy. His ship helped to evacuate the French when they were leaving Indochina. There was a French soldier who had been there for seven years, hadn't been home for seven years, and he traded Larry a gun for a can of beans. He said they were starving. And then, he helped evacuate the Chinese-Cheng Kaichek, you know? He has a lot of pictures. He has a picture of a little girl, who had died, and they dressed her, put her in a chute, and buried her in the ocean. He has pictures where the ship was just crammed with Chinese. He went in when he was 17 and got out three years later. After he got out he went into an agricultural program. He had a friend, who had a shoe shop, and he persuaded Larry to learn to do shoe repair. So, Larry went to Denver (he was married then), to the Emily Griffith Opportunity School, which is a famous school. He went there almost a year, and came back and had his shoe shop. Then he wanted to learn how to make cowboy boots, so he sent to Oklahoma to a junior college. He was there almost a year, then came back. We had the shop over here where the Peddler's is located. My parents farmed, dad was a good farmer. My dad came from the Indian Territory in 1898. He sold his farm, and his older sister, his older brother, and his older sister's daughter and her baby came to Glenwood Springs (on up from Grand Junction). �In the middle of the winter they came to Glenwood Springs, and the climate is about like Durango. I don't know how they got to Collbran, but he played the violin or he played the fiddle, and that's where he met my mother. My mother was born in Boulder. She was 34 when I was born. She was 28 when they were married and my dad was 37. We can't find anything out about my dad's ancestors, because we didn't listen. I didn't listen to my dad. And, I didn't know until long after he was gone, but he grew up with blacks and Indians. I didn't know that after the Civil War, the blacks were encouraged to settle in Oklahoma, to homestead in OK. But, what I remember was they would swim in the creeks, and there was a small pox epidemic. They would line up along the banks and keep the Indians and the blacks from going in the water. Because, you know, then they wouldn't break out, and a lot of them died. There was an old, old Indian who lived up from where my dad lived, and it wasn't derogatory then to say "nigger". My dad always called him "Nigger John", and never thought anything about it. But, the reason my dad came to CO, he had an older brother who came to the San Luis Valley (over by Alamosa). I don't know why [the brother] came to Alamosa. There he met a Mormon woman, got married, had 12 children over the years, and moved to Collbran. I don't know why he came to CO [the older brother?]. But, people did move about. I have a book on both sides of my mother's family. All I know is that she was Pennsylvania Dutch, but German from way back. My grandmother's grandmother, I think it was, her husband was killed by the nobility in Germany. She escaped, she had an older child who had come to America, but she escaped into France and Switzerland. A single woman couldn't come on the ship to America, so she married a Hessian soldier. But, she couldn't pay the passage for her youngest child, so he was bound out to somebody for the passage. My mother's maiden name was Strock, my maiden name is Barker. I joined the D.A.R. [Daughters of the American Revolution] about 35 years ago. I can go back on either side of my mom's family: her father was a Tylson, and her mother's side, which was Strock. But, Strock had been three different spellings: Strauck, Strack, and Strock. So, it was easier to go back on her mother's side, on the Strock side. My grandfather was English. I go back to the Mayflower on the English side. My genealogy goes back to when they first came to America, and that was the first generation. I'm about the eleventh generation, I think. There is a Tylson reunion in NY every year. They have Larry's name and my sister's four children's names. I had one ancestor who fought at Valley Forge, it could have been a Tylson or a Strock. My dad was born in Coles [?] County, Illinois. His dad was a horse trader, so they moved from one place to another. I can remember that my dad had a brother named Red, because my dad said that he was the only redheaded one in the family. He also had a brother who settled in MO. There was a big family in the Barkers. My son looks like a Barker in the face: they have thin noses and faces. There are no fat ones in that family. My grandson, Kenny, has red hair, and will be 24 on the 31 st of January [2004]. He was born on my way to Nebraska. �I know that this house was hauled up here in 1948 [the house was ordered from a Montgomery Ward catalog]. Thank God that the woodwork has never been painted-this is the original woodwork. There are doors in this house you can't believe. I think there are about 11 doors in here. Interviewed by Michael Miller, Americorps*VISTA for the Ignacio Historical Society, December 9th, 2003. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Michael Miller Interviews Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/CNE/1.0/ Date Created Date of creation of the resource. 2003-2004 Subject The topic of the resource Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Description An account of the resource Collection of twelve biographies written by VISTA worker Michael G. Miller of prominent people in the Ignacio community. Based on interviews conducted by Miller between December 9, 2003 and March 15, 2004. Some contain the additional attribution "for the Ignacio Historical Society." Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Miller, Michael G. Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Ethel Smith Biography Date Created Date of creation of the resource. 2003-12-09 Subject The topic of the resource Smith, Ethel; Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Description An account of the resource Biography of Ethel Smith written by VISTA worker Michael Miller and based on an interview conducted by Miller on December 9, 2003. Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Smith, Ethel Extent The size or duration of the resource. 5 pages https://voicesofignacio.cvlcollections.org/files/original/9ceb87890bfca639bf41f7cb21bbc6bd.pdf e4d9929ba37084f4f7d05d4da52d4917 PDF Text Text Adela Quintana (Abridged) I'm Adela Quintana. My maiden name was Mascarenas: Adela Mascarenas. I was born in 1923: August the 261\ 1923. I was born on just over the other side of the ni>ver from Rosa until I was three years old and then we moved to Silverton. My parents: Serestino Mascarenas and [?] Quintana. Three years we stayed in Silverton and then my parents moved back to Rosa and bought a ranch where the Navajo Dam is. We stayed on that ranch until I got married in 1940. All those I spent on my dad's ranch. Back and forth we went to school in Rosa from the ranch. After I got married, I married[?] Quintana, I stayed in Rosa until they built the Navajo Dam. I had all my family in Rosa except one. I have a great big family, a family of 10: five boys and five girls. My husband went into the service when I had my first little baby, Nadi Quintana Silva (she's Silva now). He stayed in the service for about three years. He never did get to know his first daughter until returning from the service. We moved to Ignacio and we stayed in Ignacio from 1960 until now. All my family is scattered all over. I'm happy and blessed with my family and that I don't have any trouble with my family at all. My husband, he was sick all this time after he came from the service. He stayed in hospitals on and on, and on, for years and years. I had to raise my family and find work for myself. All my family finished high school, finished college. I have a girl who's a doctor. All my kids have pretty good jobs. My oldest daughter is working in Washington, D.C. for the government. One of my sons is an architect in Castle Rock [, CO], and one of my sons is the Town Manager here in Ignacio. I have a daughter that is married to a doctor and she lives in Farmington. Another daughter is married to a schoolteacher and she lives in Arizona. My oldest daughter lives in Denver. One son I have in Philadelphia. He was in the service a long time and got out. A daughter works as a secretary over in Bayfield. They all have pretty nice jobs. I moved from my ranch. I had five acres that I bought in 1960. But, I couldn't handle the ranch and the five acres by myself So, I moved to town. I'm living here now. I'm closer to everyone, to stores and to church. I can still do my driving to go to church. My family will check on me once in a while, see ifl need anything. I've been real blessed with my whole family. My father used to work in the gold mines in Silverton. Finally he moved and continued being a rancher. We raised cattle, sheep, pigs, all kinds of animals. The first time l started school was in Rosa. Matter of fact, I started in Allison for one month. I was old already when I started: I was eleven. But, I passed several grades in one year, and my teachers kept giving me classes so that I could catch up. I graduated from the eighth grade when I was 18. I graduated from the eighth grade when I was supposed to be graduating from high school. Then I just started working after I finished the eighth grade. I worked painting houses, cleaning houses, on the ranch in Rosa and Arboles ... around those places. I have three brothers and one sister. �Page 2 of3 I didn't get any compensation from my husband, because he was mentally ill. The first time he came, he burned all of my papers. I had a hard time to get my papers back. I had six of my children before I got any compensation from the government. The four last ones are seven years apart and I started getting compensation. With that I paid for their school (for the four youngest ones). For the other ones, I supported them by working everywhere I could work. No welfare, just working. Restaurants, stores in Arboles and Rosa, painting stores in and out ... real hard jobs that I used to do. When we moved to Ignacio it was a little better, because there was more work and I could make a little more money. Three or four years after we moved here they sent me to Oklahoma so that I could get a degree to teach Head Start. I got my degree and came back, and my oldest kids took care of the youngest ones. I worked for three years at the Head Start. I was the first one to start working at the Head Start ere in Ignacio. After three years I started getting compensation for my last kids. When I got compensation, they said I couldn't work anymore with the Head Start. I worked in the restaurant and for seven years at Peaceful Spirit (I was a cook). But, I did pretty good and I'm very proud of my family. I never did have any problems with my kids ... never, with the law or anything. So, I'm grateful for that. My husband died in 1990. He stayed in the veterans' hospital. I was all by myself .. my kids were all out and working. But, I've always done all of my work, all kinds of work. I wire my house, plumb my house. I did everything and saved a lot of money doing all the work myself Sometimes I have a little trouble with the electricity here. But, I have a son who's a pretty good worker with electricity. (He works for the casino in maintenance.) So, I take advantage of him now that I'm getting older and I can't do it. But, I'm still doing all right. I have 26 grandchildren and 14 great-grandchildren. I see them often. For my [80th] birthday they gave me a big, big surprise, and I wasn't expecting nobody. I thought I was going on vacation somewhere. They turned around and brought me back home. Someone had gotten sick, and when they brought me back, this house was packed. 58 were in this house when I walked in. I'm telling you it was a shake for me! I should have known better what was going to happen: that they were going to surprise me for my birthday. I am 80 years old now. When we were living on the ranch we didn't have church except once a month or once every three months. But, in Rosa we had a celebration on the Thirtieth of August for Santa Rosa. We used to make a big dinner, we had a real nice Mass, we'd walk around the church and carried the saint. At night we had luminarias on the church. We had a rosary the day before Santa Rosa's. It was very neat to do that. We didn't always have the celebration on Santa Rosa's day, because we didn't have a priest. But, we had it whenever a priest came in September of October. For Christmas we used to have our Midnight Mass (not in Rosa but here in Ignacio). We had the Posadas. The Posadas is a group of people and we go door to door and sing songs. Posadas is like when Joseph and Mary went door to door asking for a place for Jesus to be born, then finally he was born in a barn. We used to have a lady who did it [Posada] in Spanish, read it in Spanish. We had Posadas until she couldn't do it anymore. We have San Ignacio Day here in Ignacio with a parade and all. WE used to go around the church walking with the saint, but lately we haven't been doing those things ... short of help, short of people who can do it. There used to be really nice celebrations, really nice dinners. We'd bring bands to play for San Ignacio and �Page 3 of3 dancing in the night. We used to have two days of parades: Saturday and Sunday. But, now we just have one day, because we don't have enough help. We celebrate San Ignacio at the end of July. I do all the laundry for the Church. Sundays we have Mass I go to set up everything for the priest to have Mass. At 9:30 I open the church for the people to go in. The month of December is my month for cleaning the whole church with a group of four ladies. For many, many years I've done these things. I used to do it in Rosa, in Arboles, in Aztec; when we moved there for a little while. My husband got sick over there [in the service]; he lost his mind. He was 100% mentally disabled. He used to go for four months, one month, or nine months in the hospital. I would go and get him, but take him back because he was pretty bad, especially as he got older. He had Alzheimer's really bad. I took him to the hospital, because I thought he was a danger to the family and to myself Finally, at the end I just couldn't handle him. So, I took him to Albuquerque. That's where he died. I knew my grandparents. Pedro Quintana and Juanita Quintana were my mother's parents from Rosa, NM. My grandma had a big family, too. On my father's side were Emanuel Mascarenas and Maria de Jesus Mascarenas. They had a big family, too. They were just across on the other side of the river. The Mascarenas family came form Clayton [, NM], and they bought a ranch right here on the other side of the river. My mother was a Quintana and I married a Quintana. So, I got my mother's name, but they weren't related. I have a lot of cousins. I can't even count them. *** This house belonged to my son-in-law and my oldest daughter, and I don't own nothing. All I have is just my little Social Security. I don't want to own nothing more. I want nothing more; I divided my money to all my kids. Just my car, so I can drive while I am able to. That way, when I die, I won't have nothing. I won't have to worry about this or that, because it's all settled. That's the way I've worked my life. I have a lot of stories, a lot of long stories. But, it's too much. I was a sheepherder ... I was everything. But, long, long stories. *** Interviewed by Michael Miller (VISTA) on January 28th , 2004. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Michael Miller Interviews Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/CNE/1.0/ Date Created Date of creation of the resource. 2003-2004 Subject The topic of the resource Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Description An account of the resource Collection of twelve biographies written by VISTA worker Michael G. Miller of prominent people in the Ignacio community. Based on interviews conducted by Miller between December 9, 2003 and March 15, 2004. Some contain the additional attribution "for the Ignacio Historical Society." Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Miller, Michael G. Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Adela Quintana Biography Date Created Date of creation of the resource. 2004-01-28 Subject The topic of the resource Quintana, Adela; Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Description An account of the resource Biography of Adela Quintana written by VISTA worker Michael Miller and based on an interview conducted by Miller on January 28, 2004. Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Quintana, Adela Extent The size or duration of the resource. 3 pages https://voicesofignacio.cvlcollections.org/files/original/6513bc73038587c3e5fe20247b50ef34.pdf 4e6de020042a8ba216d9f176353a1b87 PDF Text Text Ida Kent (Southern Ute Tribal Elder) My name is Ida Kent. I was born here in Ignacio off on the reservation. There's a house now sitting on a hill where I was born. I was born at the foot of the fill there. There used to be a big reservoir that people used for their horses. It was a farming area, so that's what they used for their horses. That's where I was born, in a teepee. I was born in 1921; that's what it says on the paper. Graves Kent is my father and Ada [sic?] Rabbit Kent is my mother. She was from Breen, CO; that's where her folks lived. Where my dad's folks were from I do not know, because they moved around and they didn't really have a set place. My mother's parents had a lot of sheep, so Breen, CO was country that they took up and they lived in that area. And, she was born there. Her grandfather was Rabbit. I really don't remember his name, but they called him Mr. Rabbit. Anyway, he lived in Breen, CO; it's right south of Ft. Lewis. My parents were both Southern Ute. My brother is Bonny[?] Kent and my sister is Isabelle Kent. They're both gone, but they've got children. Bonny's children are Phoebe, Richard Kent, and Emmanuel [?] Kent. Those are the three that are here today. Isabelle's children are Charles Kent, Cynthia Kent, and Betsy Kent. The two girls are up in ... they're working in ... I don't remember. Charlie is around, but I don't know where he is. Those are the three of hers. My children are Albert Kent and Ida[?] Ray Kent (that's her name); she lives down in Albuquerque. My son lives here in Ignacio. I didn't get married until about 1963. I went to the public school in Ignacio until I was in the fourth or sixth grade. I liked the girls, which went to the public school, from the Indian school. I'd ask them, 'what do you do at that school?' And they told me what the girls did. I liked what I heard, so I asked ifl could go to the Indian school. I asked them if it was possible for me to go to school with the Indians. They said, 'sure you can go to the Indian school, but it won't be like the public school. There are a lot of things that are different.' I said, 'I just want to go to be like a girl, to sew or to be a homemaker,' and they laughed at me. But, anyway, I went to public school up to third or fourth grade. So, I went to school up there. I know the sewing machine (the electric sewing machine). I know the electric iron. There were a lot of things I learned that were so useful. Washing clothes: I had a couple of tubs of hot water and washed our clothes on the weekend and be ready for school the next week. I enjoyed going to school at the Indian school. I learned to do many things, like the sewing machine. I sewed my own dress that was torn. I forgot to take my finger away from the needle and sewed my finger right here [points and laughs]. But, nobody was there to help me except for a lady who said, 'what are you doing? Sewing your finger through the needle?' I said, 'I was too slow,' and they said, 'yeah, it's too fast for people like you who don't know how to handle themselves.' That's what I did. Things that were electric were kind of hard to use, but I got used to using them. It was all right afterwards; I enjoyed being there. �Page 2 of3 How many years was I there? Well, they took me when I was in the fourth grade. I must have been in there for four years until I changed back to public school. I didn't want to go back, but my dad said I should go back to do more lessons. I was doing sewing anyway; that was to be my life. Going to school. .. I didn't do so good. But, I went back to public school. I think I just ~w&W ~ clt,-'atkt rherr when-I wasLlrr rhe-tlimir gra1ie-fqui:t- scllooT'- -I hat wa'sn" t 'ri:ghr, .Jambrly'dad was so mad at me. He didn't think I should be punished like any other person. He wanted me to, but he didn't. So, I quit and didn't go to school no more. After that I had my little boy: Albert Kent. So, he's about 70 years old, I think. I'm not quite sure; I've forgotten how old he has become. All that time after I quit school I went back to work at the dorm. I worked with the boys and the girls as an attendant. There were a lot of things I learned that were well worth training for. I didn't become anything that was a better life, but it was a good life in a way. The time that I was sick I couldn't go back to work, so I decided I better quit. They let me quit, and that was in 1975. I spoke English all that time, because I was working with those people. The Navajo don't have the same language, so we spoke in English together. So, practically, I just lived the English way. Once I learned it I lived that life. Maybe it's not the best story I should say, but it's the best I have. *** I used to dance. I'm not one to say I'm 'it'; I don't know all about it. But, when there was a dance I'd go dance. When there was a Bear Dance I'd go dance. There was the Round dance, so I Round danced. I would do the Gourd Dance when they would have it at our Ute Fair. They used to come up and do that, so I danced now and then. People are, as you'd say, members. But, I didn't become a member and only the members could dance. *** I know just part of my grandparents. Oh, what was his name ... John Russell; that was my mother's father. He lost his parents, too, when he was a baby. A lot of people were still roaming then. They didn't have a place to stay, but they said this was tribal land. So, he lived around here. When he moved out to Towoac that's where he met my grandma. So, that's where he stayed, and they lived together. How long I do not know. Anyway, he was gone again. I guess at that time people could give it up and they got something else. That's the way he was: he was a roamer. He had other children, too, after that. So, I don't know too much about them. I knew my father's parents. I knew my grandpa. It was my grandma that I knew that became a landowner on this side of Oxford. I knew the area, but I can't think of it right now. Anyway, that area was big enough, so my grandma took up that. She had my dad, my aunt ... Amy, Mary, my dad. I guess my grandpa passed away up in Utah, where he was from. His parents were from Utah. He passed away, so I just know my grandma; her name is Isabelle ... her name was Ruby Stone Kent. She married John Kent; who was my dad's father. He was from Utah. My mother's were from Breen, CO. �Page 3 of3 *** We had horses ... wagons and horses. So, we more or less rode wagons and buggies or horseback. The first time I rode in an automobile was when I was going to the dorm. I don't know if it was a tribal thing that took us to Durango to buy clothes or what. But, four of us girls from the dorm, from Ignacio went to buy some clothes. Instead of a bus, it was a truck that took us to Durango. I kind ofremember a little bit about that. One of the girls was saying, 'When I'm able to go on my own, I'll be buying me an automobile so I can drive.' As we were coming out from Durango the road there wasn't as it is now. Anyway, we were going down the road and got a flat. We had to get off the truck. We used to tease that girl and laugh. She said, laughing, 'When I get a flat I'll be walking home with my bags.' We were laughing about dragging our stuff home, because not more car. Oh, boy. I don't even remember the girl's name we were laughing about. But, it was so funny. *** We learned to make a garden by a group of girls and boys of the same grade. They were saying, 'this is how you do it when you go home and have a home: you make yourselves a garden. These are things to eat ... like potatoes.' There are a lot of things that they taught us that are useful for eating. We also had rabbits and onions. They were good, too. *** You know, I should have given a thought ( maybe a long time ago) as to how I would put my story together. But, I didn't even think about it. I'm at a loss now to tell my story fully and, maybe, differently. That's the best I've done. *** Well, at least they [Ida's grandchildren] will know that there were a lot of things that were different then than it is today. And, it was really hard to have things, because you didn't have money. We had things we could us at that time. At that time we didn't have electricity, but we still traveled on horses. Not much of anything that you would call was precious to us except horses and wagons and a home; that were teepees or tents. (Not many of us had homes except teepees.) But, I guess it was very useful, because I came out of it. [Laughs]. In a way I'm glad I lived then. Now, everything is different and easier than at the time that I was little, or at the time I became knowledgeable of myself Now things are a lot better than what they were a long time ago. It was all learning and hardship and all, but we really learned to live. And, we were always happy to be together with our family. Let's say, I'm very happy to be with my people that are here today. And, that's about it, I guess. Interviewed Michael G. Miller (VISTA worker) on January 23, 2004. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Michael Miller Interviews Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/CNE/1.0/ Date Created Date of creation of the resource. 2003-2004 Subject The topic of the resource Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Description An account of the resource Collection of twelve biographies written by VISTA worker Michael G. Miller of prominent people in the Ignacio community. Based on interviews conducted by Miller between December 9, 2003 and March 15, 2004. Some contain the additional attribution "for the Ignacio Historical Society." Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Miller, Michael G. Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Ida Kent Biography Date Created Date of creation of the resource. 2004-01-23 Subject The topic of the resource Kent, Ida; Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Description An account of the resource Biography of Ida Kent written by VISTA worker Michael Miller and based on an interview conducted by Miller on January 23, 2004. Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Kent, Ida Extent The size or duration of the resource. 3 pages https://voicesofignacio.cvlcollections.org/files/original/1c507177d149ffe9f913e6c6fbd8709d.pdf 3f6d3b1594cd7f1850340688f84440b8 PDF Text Text Ruby Garcia (Southern Ute Elder) My name is Ruby T. Garcia, and I live at 1328 County Road 516, Ignacio, CO 81307. I was born on November 24th, 1918 in Ignacio. That was during the war; First World War. My first school was at Santa Fe. We left on the train and when we got to Santa Fe, they told us to go to our grade room. They asked my sister first what grade she was, and she said she was third grade. Then they asked me, and I told them I was third grade. But, I didn't even know nothing; I didn't even know how to read, I didn't even know how to talk English. And, they sent me back to the kindergarten. But, I finally picked up. That's about it at Santa Fe. I've been to different places. I've been to Towaoc Indian School; I was there from the third and fourth. Then I went to school at Ignacio for fifth, sixth, seventh, and eighth. And then, I went to Sherman Institute in Riverside, CA I graduated there. I took up home economics, but like I always tell the people, 'I'm a jack of all trades and a master at none.' I came home; I got a job at the hospital. I was a Nurse's Aide. That was kind of interesting; working with sick people and caring for them. Then I went to different places. I went to Salt Lake City and I sewed a lot. Sewed clothes for the Army. Then I went to Salt Lake. I worked there for a while: making swim suits. Then I decided to go (World War II was going on), to go to California and get me a job. They hired me, they said I had to drive. And, I told them I didn't know how to drive. They said, 'Well, you're froze to it. You're going to learn one way or the other.' So I finally learned how to drive a bus. I drove the Italian prisoners to work, you know, there on the field. But, there were MPs [military policemen] on the bus and I wasn't afraid. I'd hear them talk, and I asked one of the Italians if they knew English. And, they pointed to one and they said, 'Oh, they're telling you bad things.' I told them, 'You tell them I told them to shut up or they're going to get out!' Boy they were quiet. I had to laugh at them. We ate with them at the mess hall. They had their own, you know; the prisoners-of-war. But it was interesting. Afterwards I wasn't afraid of them; I got used to them. And then the war was over. .. I came home. Now I'm here, in one piece. I worked for the Tribe. I worked with them for twelve years; with the welfare. After that I worked for the Peaceful Spirit; that's alcohol. I went to training to be a counselor. I enjoyed it. But, then, I got tired of the whole thing. I said I might as well retire, and I retired. Now I'm home and I'm enjoying it: I go to the casino and have fun, lose or win. Sometimes I win and sometimes I lose, but it's fun. I meet a lot of people, I enjoy it; it's something different than to live alone. Living alone, people say, is aweful. But, I manage. I crochet, I do beadwork, I occupy my time, and when I'm tired of that, I go to the casino and talk and laugh and joke with them people. Lately, I've been in poor health. Other than that, I'm okay. My folks come to see me. That's my great-granddaughters [two ofRuby's great-granddaughters and her great-greatgrandson were present during the interview] and that little one is my great great grandson. And thi.s little one [the father of Ru by' s great great grandson], we' re going to send him to dance at the �powwow [Laughter]. They're going to have a powwow pretty soon. They're having two powwows next month; one for the casino and one for Gerald Hall [?]. [M. Miller: What were your parents' names?] I was born out of wed-lock, let's put it that way. But, I knew who my father was; he came to me. My mother's name was Uterpy [sic?] Taylor. That's why my name was Ruby Taylor, because she wasn't married when she had me. But just the same, life went on. Life has been good, and it's still good providing I get off of this oxygen! And, now, they've got me blowing on that thing [points to a medical device] in my mouth. Pretty soon you'll see me like this [makes a bloated gesture], full of air. My daughter's grandson told me, 'Grandma, your stomach is getting big. Are you going to have a baby?' And I said, 'No, I'm full of air.' [Laughs] And he said, 'How did you get that air inside of you?' And I told him through this [points to the oxygen tube in her nostrils]. You know, they're funny. They say, 'no fools, no fun.' Right? That's about my life. [M. Miller: 'What was your husbands name?'] My husband's name was Joe Weaver; the father ofmy two daughters (Arlene and Lillian). They're both married and look at all that bunch of accumulated kids from me and them two girls [points to a wall full of photographs]. There's five generations on there. Quite a bunch, huh? Look at this white-headed woman [points to herself in a generational picture of her family]. [Laughs] There's five generations there; there's this little one when he was small [her great great-grandson]. Well, it's good to be old and retired: staying home; don't have to worry about getting up or nothing. But I hate to get sick. [M. Miller: 'What do you remember about Sherman Indian School?'] I went to school there, I took up home economics. Learned how to cook; learned how to sew; learned different things (canning, all that stuff). I liked it. I even went back to see the place after I finished. Some of the old employees were still there. But, in those days things were cheap. I tell the people, bread used to be 10 cents a loaf You could buy tennis shoes like that for a $1.98. You don't get them for no $1.98 anymore; they run from 60 on down. And other, regular shoes (you know, I call them 'dancing shoes'), they're high priced, too. I think the cheapest is $20. Food used to be cheap. Gas was $.25 a gallon, and look at it now. It's outrageous. It's gone up, up, up. It was hard for the people. Frank B. (he used to be an Anglo), he used to run a meat shop. He used to donate food for the people to have a Bear Dance and a feast. They'd cook out there. Oh, it was nice, but now it's so different. Everything is so high, and I don't ever remember paying income tax. I don't know when that started, because I never paid income tax. Or, maybe I overlooked it, didn't bother to do income tax. But, now, you have to. �That's about the story of my life. I don't know what else there would be. [M. Miller: 'Did you have brothers and sisters?'] I had brothers and sisters. My sister died, my two brothers died, and there's only one brother left: Sylvian Taylor Valdez and me. There're just two ofus left. But my mother ... she had one brother living, Henry .Taylor, but he passed away about three or four months ago (I don't remember). He died. I lost my mother March the 24th, 1994. It's sad; sadness. Now I'm all alone here. I don't like to interfere with my daughters: living with them (sort oflike 'mooching'). I'd rather live alone and live my own life. Get up when I feel like it; eat when I feel like it; go to bed when I feel like it: nobody to boss me. But, my younger daughter tells me (she sees me at the casino), 'Aren't you ready to go home?' And I told her, 'No, I'm having a good time. You go home.' [Laughs] And I stayed down there. Then I called my brother up: 'Come and get me. Come and take me home,' when it's over. But, the casino never closes. The people are still pulling on them machines. The card table, where I usually play, closes up at four. (But they usually close up at 3 :30 to clean up and count the money.) So, I had my days too; go down there. I have won a big jackpot; $36,000. I won about four jackpots for $2,700 and I won several ones for $1,200. But boy they really soaked me for income tax this past year. I said, 'I ain't got no business winning so much. So I quit. I just play cards where they don't take income tax. [M. Miller: 'Did you dance when you were younger?'] Oh, boy. Believe it! I used to do the twist and everything [laughs]. They had a dance down here and my uncle, the one that died that I was telling you about, came over. They were having a dance dontest, and he came over to me and said, 'Come on. Let's dance, let's show them how it's done.' So we went, and we won. They gave us $20, you know prize? But, now, I can't even dance. My leg is still crippled up. That money cart at the casino hit me right here [points to left leg], and since then I've been sick. My leg swells up and then I have a blood clot on this leg. They doctored me on that; they gave me pills. Look at all these pills that I take ... very sickening [laughs]. I used to like it [the Bear Dance]. I used to do the "Forty-nine," the powwow; I used to do that. But, now, I don't do nothing. I stay home, I watch TV, go to bed, eat, go to the casino, and come home and go to bed, then start all over again. I don't go down there every day. Certain times. They were going to give a car away and they called my name, my ticket. They had a lot of them over there get one. They called my name in there, and I won a free room at the casino and two meals for two. I said, 'For two? Where's my better half?' And them guys stopped and said, 'Me!' And I told them, 'No, I'm not going to take you. Beat it!' [Laughs] I know Spanish, I know Ute, and I know a little bit of Navajo and Paiute; I know Paiute. I understand Italian, because Italian is almost like Spanish. Do you think I had an interesting life? �Yeah, I don't want to win too much money, because they said I make too much money and cut it off There's always a trick. They put up a casino where you make money, and then when you make money they want a cut of30% off Gosh. IfI would have known, I wouldn't have played that much. But, when I paly at the poker, then they give me tickets. They give them to me and I sign my name. They called my name and them people hollered, 'There she is!' [laughs] I had fun. My brother's son won the Jeep; he won it. [M. Miller: 'Did you ever serve on the Tribal Council?'] No. I didn't have time for that. I was too busy helping the poor people. You know, helping them to get pensions. Helping them, you know, what needs to be done. After I got through eith that, I kind of helped the people that drink a lot. I used to drink a lot, too, after the war ... beer. [M. Miller: 'Did you serve on the Committee of Elders?'] Yeah, I was the first Chairman. They gave a party when I retired, and they gave me that blanket. That's a Pendleton blanket; costs lots of money. The Council gave me that, and the one that's on my bed, the Committee of Elders gave me that; another Pendleton blanket. But, I'm satisfied. The Tribe gives the elders $3, 100 every month. That keeps you going. It keeps me going to the casino [laughs]. Look at him [Ruby's great great-grandson], he's still looking at me. He doesn't know me too well. Go to sleep, go to sleep [to her great great-grandson]. I'm glad to know that all my tw.o daughters, my grandchildren and all, have finished school and gone on to college. They have even graduated from college. Interviewed by Michael Miller (VISTA worker) in her home on March 29th, 2004. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Michael Miller Interviews Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/CNE/1.0/ Date Created Date of creation of the resource. 2003-2004 Subject The topic of the resource Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Description An account of the resource Collection of twelve biographies written by VISTA worker Michael G. Miller of prominent people in the Ignacio community. Based on interviews conducted by Miller between December 9, 2003 and March 15, 2004. Some contain the additional attribution "for the Ignacio Historical Society." Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Miller, Michael G. Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Ruby Garcia Biography Date Created Date of creation of the resource. 2004-03-29 Subject The topic of the resource Garcia, Ruby; Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Description An account of the resource Biography of Ruby Garcia written by VISTA worker Michael Miller and based on an interview conducted by Miller on March 29, 2004. Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Extent The size or duration of the resource. 4 pages https://voicesofignacio.cvlcollections.org/files/original/2a0d9045a3b07548f6ebf6f4d4aafa47.pdf 08ce23f4a3724c07aa8244ae8f78fa25 PDF Text Text Cleo Garcia Cleo was born in Blanco, New Mexico on May 1st, 1924. She moved to Ignacio, CO when she was four years old with her parents, grandpa, and aunts. She grew up on a farm about five miles from Ignacio, where her family raised cows, pigs, and chickens. "We used to come to Ignacio once a month, or maybe twice of month, to get groceries. The town wasn't very big then. My grandpa used to sell wood here to the Indians. I went to school in Ignacio for one year. We used to go to a farm school; it was like five miles away from home. A one-room school. I think I went there for four years, and then I went over here for a year in Ignacio. I didn't graduate [from high school]. We didn't move here [to Ignacio] until I was nineteen. I moved here with my aunts and my grandpa. We didn't have no water, no electricity, no nothing there [on the farm]." When Cleo moved to Ignacio she went to work cleaning houses. She said, "I didn't know very good English, and I still don't." Cleo's grandfather and aunts raised her. "I had a bunch of brothers and one sister, but they stayed in Blanco. I came with my parents, my grandpa and aunts over here. I don't know why, but I did. We used to plant a lot of corn and beans, make a big garden over there. It was dry land, but you know, it used to rain once in a while. So, we used to go about our things. We had chickens, and we had horses, cows, and pigs. They were just for our own use." Cleo married Frank Garcia shortly after she and her family moved into Ignacio. They had one daughter, Patricia, and Cleo has a grandson. "I remember there used to be a hardware [store] not tCXifar from here. And, I think we used to have one train station. But, we had to come here from the farm on a wagon, horses, because we didn't have cars then. We used to come to church on Sundays on a wagon, real early in the morning. It took us about a couple hours, I guess. We used to walk too, sometimes, or on horseback. My aunts used to tell me about the Great Depression, but I don't remember it. My uncle used to have one of those little cars, you know? We used to ride in the back, because they were small cars, real small. What did they used to call them? Model Ts. My uncle used to have sheep. I worked while she [Patricia] was little. I worked for farmers, you know, doing their housework. I was a dishwasher and a cleaning lady. My husband used to work for the farmers- out in the fields, bailing hay, stuff like that. My daughter went to school here, she graduated from here [Ignacio]. She has that little store up there [on Goddard Ave.], the thrift store. They also sell new clothes. Her husband works there, too. My grandson is working in Bayfield, he's working for some employer. They make buttons, but he's a receiver. I think he makes the orders, he orders things. �We used to celebrate San Ignacio. We used to come for San Ignacio. That used to be a lot of fun. Oh, they used to have dances, they used to have church in the morning. Sometimes they used to have a carnival. I worked at the Senior Center for nine years. I used to clean the place. Then I moved from there and went to the library. I worked there for about five years. I liked that job; it was nice. My boss and I used to get along good; she was good. She's no longer there. Then, I was old enough to get Social Security so I didn't work no more.11 \ Interviewed by Michael Miller (Americorps*VISTA volunteer) for the Ignacio Historical Society, December 15th, 2003. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Michael Miller Interviews Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/CNE/1.0/ Date Created Date of creation of the resource. 2003-2004 Subject The topic of the resource Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Description An account of the resource Collection of twelve biographies written by VISTA worker Michael G. Miller of prominent people in the Ignacio community. Based on interviews conducted by Miller between December 9, 2003 and March 15, 2004. Some contain the additional attribution "for the Ignacio Historical Society." Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Miller, Michael G. Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Cleo Garcia Biography Date Created Date of creation of the resource. 2003-12-15 Subject The topic of the resource Garcia, Cleo; Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Description An account of the resource Biography of Cleo Garcia written by VISTA worker Michael Miller and based on an interview conducted by Miller on December 15, 2003. Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Extent The size or duration of the resource. 2 pages https://voicesofignacio.cvlcollections.org/files/original/25d99f8b3b18bc4a91f7517106d26511.pdf f0f2fa1d2290e406eb0a52a3326ada58 PDF Text Text Neil Cloud (Southern Ute Tribal Elder) My name is Neil Buck Cloud; I'm the NAGPRO [Native American Graves Protection] coordinator for the Southern Ute Tribe at the current time. I was born at Towaoc, CO. At that time the Southern Ute Tribe did not have a hospital here [Ignacio]. So all the mothers had to go over to Towaoc to give birth; that's where a hospital was. We didn't have a hospital. A year or two later Taylor Hospital was built; which functions as the Southern Ute Tribal Building. It's an old building. Then, when I was born over there, I came back. We didn't have roads like this. It used to be gravel roads. It was winter and they said they had to deliver me. They walked part of the way, most of the way, through all that snow. Where the current BIA building is, there used to be an old building that was made originally out of wood. And, that burned down with all the tribal records. Finally, they built another one right under it. There's a tree still standing there that you will notice in old pictures. The museum currently has pictures of the Utes standing there. That was the old BIA building. When they built the new BIA building that was in 1940 ... somewhere in that area. And, when I was growing up, I used to play there; I remember that as a boy. We used to play, at that time Billy Rock and I, we used to play in the foundation; that's what I remember. At that time, our fathers were the Southern Ute Tribal Policemen. And, if you look right off north there, the jail is still standing there: the little cement building that you see. If you look north, it's still there. There were houses towards the south; those were the houses where our parents lived. And, there were a few sheds (warehouses) a little bit to the west ofus, southwest. Two buildings I think it was, or three ... huge: we used to all go to there and play. There used to be a whole mess of sheep pelts in there. During that time the tribe had sheep (we owned the sheep). Also, during that time, individual families had sheep and there was a Southern Ute Sheep Association, also, which we owned together. Every spring we used to take them up to Williams Creek and north ofVallecito Dam in that National Forest area. We had trouble with bears, and we had to have a quota [of sheep] for the National Fore st. We had to purchase 30,000 more. So, I don't know how many total we had, because there were several families. But, over the following ears, we kept saying that bears killed our sheep. Finally it added up and we had bucks. I guess they got old also, because they died. We had, I don't know 50 or 100 head of bucks, and we kept them separate. Well, that's my experience. During the time when I heard these stories, the Indians were still riding horses at that time. Well, there was a store there next to that office that burned down; where the Ute Park entrance is today. A little south of there was a warehouse. The Indian agents used to say that Hans Aspas was the one who had it, or one of them. And, over a period oftime (when he was in charge), the way the story goes, he used to get the wagons that were given to us by the United States Government. Over that period he accumulated a lot of money. And, that's how Ignacio became the little city of Ignacio. That part is just hearsay, you see. I just heard it and didn't see it for myself I just heard the people talk about it. �Page 2 of9 One thing is very important according to the story of how Ignacio was built. First, it was supposed to have been built in Tiffany, CO; which is about 15 miles southeast oflgnacio. And, something happened over there and they moved it to this area: the Pine River area. Well, there's a slaughterhouse where the Town is supposed to be, over the hill. I've been there, there's a lot of debris. The first one (I forget the Spanish guy's name), he was the very first guy to build a saloon. The pieces of wood that you find are part of the foundation of that saloon. And then, during that time, something happened. They moved to where the current Ignacio is, and he had to move his saloon back down. That's why there are pieces of debris there; I've been there. I don't know what condition it's in now. If you walk on over, there's a creek there. If you walk along, there's still trash from that period. There's a big question about that: how Ignacio came about and why they moved it. I never knew, never was told. That's why I say it is hearsay ... I wasn't really involved. It happened before my time, way before my time, about the time when the allotments were being created. But, I did see the Utes riding their horses right in front of that big building that they call the Legion Hall. Right across the corner from there was a drugstore, as I remember. And, I remember the druggist's name: it was Britt, and I remember that because he sold ice cream. Us little guys used to go get ice cream there. Every time we went to town that was the first place we went to. And, right across it was the Legion Hall; it's still standing today. That's where the Spanish people put on dances. That was the only big building and that's where they used to have dances (right next to the police station, where the hitching post was). That's where the Utes used to tie their horses and their wagons. There used to e a whole bunch of them where the station is today. Also, the Ignacio High School was built where the grade school is. It was a tall building: two stories. That's where the Anglo kids went to school and some of the Ute kids went there, too. I went to this one here (we had an Indian school, also). The boarding school. .. during the early days we lived so far from the school that we were all scattered all throughout this reservation. We didn't have no buses during those days. Some of them had to ride horseback when they went to school. Some of the Utes went to school over towards Mesa Mountains; which is about a good 10 or 15 miles from here. There was another country school over there. Some of them had to suffer every winter riding horses to get to school. And, there's another Indian school up over northeast from here, about 15 miles out. But, there's a little country school. .. some of those people went to that one. It was muddy and they had a rough time being out in the country. That's why the Bureau of Indian Affairs built this Indian school. According to my dad, who went to school here, this boarding school was ... I still remember it; it was functioning a few years back. But, they built an additional part to it and it got bigger. Whereas the old one was funny looking: narrow and long. It was divided: one side was the girls' section and the other side was for the boys. There was a sign there, when it was built, and I remember seeing it. I believe it said, '1889'; that's when my dad went to school, when he was a little guy. They said his dad came and got home and never told them he was putting him in school. According to his story, he just thought he was going for a ride with his dad and he was happy. But, he left him at that boarding school and he cried. When he was over �Page 3 of9 there, I guess he cried so much that when one of the girls got him, they calmed him down and took care of him. He was the littlest one there. That's the way he was healthy about telling that story; I remember that part. 'My dad did me wrong by not telling me,' he'd say. 'I'm still mad at my dad (which was Edwin Cloud).' I remember him [Edwin Cloud], too, vaguely. He had braids, but I really didn't know him too well. They just pointed him out and said that's my grandfather. That's how I knew him. But, I never did know him too well, because he lived down by Spring Creek and I lived where my mother lived ( down three miles south oflgnacio). My mother's maiden name was Buck: Molly Buck. My grandmother was married to Antonio Buck, Sr.; he was the son of Charlie Buck. Actually, 'Buckskin Charlie' was not his real name. His real name was Charlie Buck. That's where the misconception comes out. Not very many people know his real name. 'Charlie Buck' would have been his name in the Census, if there were any when he was born. That was way before the creation of this reservation. Well, he used to live in Colorado Springs. That's where most of the pictures came out of; they were taken over there. But, he was moved here. Some of the Utes didn't have no birth certificates, because they were born at home. While he was growing up, he also served as a scout with the Fourth Cavalry. The cavalry, the soldiers had to keep the Utes in the interior of the reservation, to isolate them (so the Government said). He did serve with the Fourth Cavalry. (I don't know where they were stationed). As a scout, I guess he used to kill deer for the soldiers to eat. He'd butcher them and skin them; he'd save the hide, and right then he'd start tanning it. When the soldiers saw him that's how his name was created: the soldiers called him 'Buckskin' and used his first name as his last name. I guess he liked his nickname. Being a scout is king of a prestige position, important. He felt he was an important guy, so he kept the name. I don't know how many years he served with the soldiers, and that's how he became 'Buckskin Charlie.' Only we family members knew his real name: Charlie Buck. The Tribal Council, for a while, continued to claim that the family of Charlie all died off But, there are still a lot of them living. They even have a newspaper clipping telling about his commission in the Fourth Cavalry. Now that's not the Fort Lewis ... I don't know if that's the same bunch. With the creation of the reservation we were moved so many times. When my grandfather was living in Colorado Springs there was still a spring over there. The Garden of the Gods: that's where they lived. He roamed the whole eastern Rockies, all the way up to Boulder. He was there when the first covered wagons came across the prairie. What they call west of Boulder, these big rocks, high hills, it's called ... they called them ... I'm mixed up about them. Well, there's a Ute trail up there. It's a high place and that's where he was watching the first covered wagons coming across the prairie. He had never seen anything like that, so he waited for it ... a whole bunch of Utes waited for it. At that time, looking east you could see way out across the prairie: 80 miles ... 100 miles out, I guess, from that high point. So, they waited all day. Finally, it came to the foothills where the Colorado University is. And, they came down to meet them (they were curious to meet them, I guess). While he was there he met the wagon master and told the wagon master ... he said (well, I guess through sign language), �Page 4 of9 'these things [wagon wheels] aren't going to make it through those steep hills (which were mostly horse trails).' Some were almost 45 degrees steep. He told the wagon master, he said, 'this is the end of your trip, your travels. Your wagons will never make it over the hill.' 'You might as well plan on staying here,' he told them. 'Make your home here and we'll protect you from the enemies that come around.' There were Sioux to the north, Arapahoe and other tribes that claim that that's their homeland. They could stay on one condition: he told the wagon master, 'if you're going to stay here you have to build a house of wisdom (is what they called it).' I wrote a composition about what I heard. So, that was the beginning. The 'house of wisdom' later became the University of Colorado. So that's why it's there; it was that mutual agreement during that first encounter. That was Charlie Buck in that area. Let's see ... Denver was being built at that time. And, during that time there was that militia, Colorado Militia, which was in authority. While Denver was already being built there was another little town southeast of Colorado called Centennial. All that San Luis Valley was nothing but creeks and was home to the beaver. And there was a trapper, a Canadian trapper I think, that came into that area. All that San Luis Valley clear up to Nebraska (the Platte River) was the home of the beaver. Also, according to his [Charlie Buck's] description looking east, that whole valley was just black specks. The way he described those black specks was they looked like the flies in the fall time. Those were the buffalo, as far as he could see. I remember that description. That's how he described it. In the wintertime, when it gets cold, the flies have a tendency to come into your home and land on your wall so that it's dark ... that's the way he described it. Also, according to that picture, Centennial was a small town. Well, during that same period the Colorado Militia was out. The Colorado Militia was sponsored by the City of Denver. They were, I believe ... according to the story, separate. And, they were the ones that created the massacres in that area. Of course, in that movie it depicts that other guy, and they try to decommission the one that was supposed to be in charge. So, there was a friction there. But, according to the story, later they add the one that was authorized to be the commander in San Luis Valley had a fight with the Colorado Militia commander. So, he was chased out of that country, because he killed people in cold blood. They saw that happen right in the streets of Denver. When a wanted Indian was walking in the streets, he shot him in the back. That was the turning point: the pioneers didn't like the style of his torture. When the man was trying to turn himself in and he just shot him in the back, is how he confronted him. Well, what brought it out was in Cripple Creek they found a lot of gold. First, that was where our reservation was big, and they discovered the gold in Cripple Creek. Well, they said, 'move the savages out West.' So, we were rounded up and we were moved. Our first agency was built down in Albuquerque, New Mexico. There were Spaniards in that Santa Fe area, also the Pueblos were too close. And, the Utes being hunters and picking berries didn't fell good being cooped up in a tight place. There was all that friction: the Pueblos were having trouble with the Spanish, too. A lot of things were happening down in New Mexico. The Utes didn't like it, and I guess we were moved to La Vida, back to La Vida. Well, we were there around Trinidad; there're Ute names in that area. I guess when we was there we were moved again, to Pagosa. Well, we were supposed to become farmers and self-supporting. �Page 5 of 9 Okay, Pagosa Springs is a high-altitude little town. That's when the Fort Lewis was built there, the first Fort Lewis. I believe the Fourth Cavalry, and maybe the Eighth too, that bunch ... Later I heard the Buffalo Soldiers were attached there, too. When we were there we complained to the government that we cannot grow food. Vegetables would rot. Besides, it was too cold for the vegetables. So, we were moved to this area where the Pine River is. Well, I've got to go back. When we was in the La Vida area, there was a river called 'Los Pines', which is still there today on the map. Okay, when we were moved from Pagosa to here, this Pine River Valley, it was called 'Los Pines.' So, today we have two Los Pines Rivers. That Spanish name followed us here; I don't know how that happened. It followed the Utes. So, today this Pine River Valley is known as the Los Pines River, but some ofus prefer to call it Pine River. Well, that's when the creation oflgnacio happened, because where I live (three miles north oflgnacio) there's that Spanish trail; it goes across my field. From Santa Fe all the way up, it goes across Ignacio Peak right there (that's where we call Cedar Ridge). I think it follows the railroad tracks here ... the D. & R.G. [Durango & Rio Grande0 that used to run through Ignacio (it runs quite a ways close to Oxford). It goes straight west, all the way to Weasel Skin Bridge. That's where the Spanish trail went. And then, from over there (the Weasel Skin Bridge is located on the Animas River), on the west side of the river it goes straight north; right where the Southern Utes are building the A-LP [Animas-La Plata Project]. Well, right where that [Home] Depot is ... the new store ... that Wal-Mart ... right south of there, there was a highway, and on the left side was a big rock as a marker for the Spanish trail. It went west, northwest, right where the A-LP is being built. And, it goes all the way west. Somewhere east of there it goes toward Delta, and then one goes south towards Towaoc. That's the way the Spanish trail went: it goes all the way up north to Grand Junction. And, as I was saying, there was a third route that cut west, a short cut they called it. The one that goes through Palisade, that was the short cut to the one that went to the gold fields of California. This one over here by Mancos Creek, we called it 'Target Tree' in the Ute language; that's what it translates to. There was only one tree. But, the way the elders came up with that they called it 'Target Tree.' So, that's what it's called today. Well, actually, when the Utes came through they always shot that tree. So, during that time it had a lot of arrows stuck up in it. When the Spanish words came to this area, the Ute language got mixed up with the Spanish. Like 'caba' and caballo,' and some other names. So, what we're speaking here is not Ute: it's colloquial, mixed, a hybrid language. We lost our language a long time ago. There's a bunch ofUtes up near Ouray that still speak the original Ute language. Eddie Box, he's still alive today, he knows some of that ... the old words. There are different words for the same things. There are a few here who are still alive. Clifford Eagle is another one that I know who might know some of those original Ute words. The ones over there at Ute Mountain have more speakers. But, the language has changed; the Ute language has changed its color. Today, according to the young generation (I listen to the radio, the Ute word of the week), parents don't teach their kids the correct way. I was involved with the language. The real Ute language is spoken softly. The suffix in a word is the tricky one. These words sound alike, but the suffix changes. So, when you hear that word you have to be careful with the tail: there's a little sound added to it. �Page 6 of9 *** My father's name was Julius Nash Cloud. He spent most of his time at this Indian school. And, this school during that time only went up to the sixth grade. So, he stayed here year-round, I believe, until he got to the sixth grade. From there he had to go to seventh grade, but there was no seventh grade school nearby. The only place there was a seventh grade was in Santa Fe: Santa Fe Indian School, and that's where he was transferred. So, during the early years he was so far away he had to ride a horse to come back. It wasn't as easy as today, when you can drive a few hours to get down there. But, during that time it took weeks, maybe, just to go the one direction. Well, he stayed there all the years. During the summer, when he didn't have school, they used to take him to the San Luis Valley to make spending money. Over there they used to pick beets. When he was there, that's when World War I broke out. So, during that time he was at the right age to get drafted ... he got drafted into the Army. He never cam home: he was too far away. But, the government made it a point for him to come home. I guess they had the automobile then. But, the government had him come back and say good-bye to his family. I guess he came back for a week, just to see his morn and dad because he was going. He went overseas. That's the part I translated for him, because the Ute Museum has a story on him. I didn't know what he experienced. I read what he wrote. Some of the things that he described weren't really the way he described them in his report. The real thing was that the feelings of the soldiers ... the farmer that he was with, the Anglo farmers, because he was drafted they were all bunched together and they had never been outside of the United States. It was the first time they had ever been in the East. And, they had that funny feeling about being moved over the ocean. They never saw an ocean that big before. Some of them cried and some of them didn't want to go. They were scared: they didn't know where they were going, nobody ever told them where they were going. They were just being herded onto that big ship, like cattle. Maybe, according to his story, it would have been all right if they were told. But, there was a vague idea there was a war going on with Germany, and a lot of them didn't know where Germany was, either. That's the way the soldiers were. That's why they were crying for their families. That's not the way it is today, because we have a lot of tourists. We go touring around the country, to see the country. In the early days it was so hard to travel, so we had to stay within our home area, within a three-mile radius, or five mile or ten mile radius of our homes. Durango was 20 miles away and that was kind of difficult, but the D. & R.G. (that little train that came through here) took some of the people to Durango. It also went all the way around to Alamosa. That was a big help to the families: the train. Yeah, I rode on it too, by the way. It was kind of a smooth ride, but all you could hear was the sound of the wheels: the clink-clink. Kind of neat ... it was better than riding on a wagon: all that rough riding. The train was real smooth, but all you could hear was the wheels all the way to Durango. The clink-clink and then the whistle: that's what I experienced. *** I finished here ... that's when it was called the Ute Vocational School. It was like home to me, because that's where I got adapted to that life. Yes, I did graduate from there. There were Navajos here, also. There was a day school for the parents, and then during that time there was a school bus. Some of those buses would come everyday to the school, but some ofus we stayed there. There were no school buses that went into the areas where some ofus lived. Not like today: now we've got a whole mess of school buses down in Ignacio. There were other kids, �Page 7 of9 Anglo kids, who were in the same fix. They had to come the hard way: they'd walk or they rode a horse in. Some of the lucky ones, if they could drive, had their parents bring them in everyday. It was the same for us up here: the buses brought some of us and dropped us off at the school, and some ofus had to stay; which was easy, because we didn't have to put up with those kinds of hardships. So, I just adapted to it, and that's why I say that it was my home. I got used to the routine. Well, I don't know, it wasn't cruel like what I've been hearing on the news with the other Indian schools in the United States that were really rough. The kids were roughly treated. That must have been before my time. Yes, we were disciplined. The best part of growing up is being disciplined if you can't behave, because there are rules to follow. As ling as you follow those rules, though, you're all right. Well, when I went to the service I had a piece of cake in the service. I went in '55; I was drafted into the Navy. Well, I was in Boulder during that time. I got six deferments. At first it was a police action [in Korea], but then the United States never declared war. During that period they never declared war officially ... not like in World War II. World War II was when I was over here and kids were disappearing. But, I didn't know there was a war with Japan; that's where they were going. And, a lot of the Navajo kids that were here were orphans. During World War II we had to go through their trunks. The matron was here; that's who signed as their parents. So all their belongings, when they got killed in the South Pacific, came back here. Greg Pinto was one that I remember; he was one of the big boys. Greg Pinto and several others never made it back. He was killed overseas and the only thing that came back was his trunk. But, I didn't understand those things really too well: why they [the trunks] were all coming back. That was during World War II. But, the United States declared war on Japan right after December 7th; that was official. That's how I perceived it: the United States didn't declare war on another country [Korea]. There was no chance for us to go over there and fight, because we had no alibi to shoot somebody. That's the way some ofus perceived it. I got on the U.S.S. Conway (aircraft carrier): Seventh Fleet, 10477. That aircraft carrier was a ship that never traveled alone. We had the whole Seventh Fleet, a whole armada; which was like a big city on the sea. We made it as far as the tip of South America going overseas. We got there on Christmas Day until finally we got the dispatch. Then, we had to go to the Philippines. So, we did an about-face. Well, I didn't exactly stay two years like I was supposed to. I came out after 18 months, because the government said we could be dismissed early. Well, I wasn't officially out: I had to be in the Reserves. I am classified A-1, which means I can still be called back. So, even today, I guess if they need me, I could still get in ... in case of an emergency_ I have a friend ... a colonel (retired), and that's what happened to him. That's how I know that the United States government is calling people back. Well, ifwe don't have to go through all that boot camp, then those ofus who are in good physical condition can still go back. According to our aptitude tests those who are up there have to train the others. �Page 8 of9 Well, with most ofus draftees (I was with a Texas Company), most ofus came out of colleges. When we got into the regular Navy, the career sailors just hated our guts. They felt like killing us, because we got in there and took that aptitude test for rank. For most of us we passed it: it was a piece of cake for us, and that was they reason they didn't like us. They wanted us out. Whereas, they had spent 16 years trying to make that same grade over and over. That was the friction. Then, the government says if we re-enlist we'd be given so much rank, be given so much money. It was on some of our minds. But, we would have never survived due to the condition, because that was how they felt [the career sailors]. We didn't want to stay. We'd rather come back home. Those ofus in college could make a living back here, not in the military. Besides, we weren't even at war. Now, that deal with the Marxists in the 60s, I didn't understand that too well in the beginning. The draft-dodgers were right. I came to my senses. If you get drafted, you have to go or spend five years in the penitentiary; which is better than feeling guilty. There was no declaration of war behind your back. We had no justification. If the United States had declared open war on another country, then we'd be justifiable ... have a justifiable condition to back it up. There was no justification for it, and a lot of them got killed for nothing. When I went in I didn't have no insurance, either. If you died at sea, which was supposed to be hazardous duty, you got extra money. I didn't get my G.I. Bill, either. A lot of us didn't get it. We were just there, and when some ofus got out we didn't have no insurance. Nothing ... not even a G.I. Bill. Today you've got to be crippled 30% to get any compensation. But even that much you can't get anything. The Agent Orange guys are creating big hospital bills, the kids are coming out deformed, and the government won't do anything for them ... giving them the run-around. The military is fine all right. The Navajos, the code-talkers, make it sound like it was a violent situation during World War II. But, there was a justification for that: the United States declared war on Japan. Whereas in our situation, there wasn't. So, why? And, besides, we were drafted; we didn't volunteer. That was the first time the Navy ever drafted. We still had to serve our six years. I finally got my discharge in 1961. Well, you have to be pretty tough to get up there on the aircraft carrier. I was in the S-1 Division, which was the backbone of the whole Fleet. I can go anywhere: Dispersement, Personnel. .. I was in the electronics part of it. The ones that really go through strict training are the submarine guys, because they have to know what to do. Well, we were trained the same way. We used to operate almost all the anti-aircraft guns. We had the '58-Dutch' anti-aircraft. I kind ofliked to operate that: the '58-Dutch.' Well, we had the regular anti-aircraft, too. It's funny .. .ifthe man on the radar got shot, we just filled in. That's the way it was. For loading, if one of the men went down, we just switched over and took his place ... until we all got wiped out [laughs]. Well, it was teamwork. I didn't have to be taught all that stuff over again, because I already learned it in the boarding school. I already knew how to wash my clothes. That's why I say it was a piece of cake. If one ofus messed up, we all got punished together. In the Navy, ifwe got punished, we had to go march at two o'clock in the morning all the way up to reveille. By that time we were so sleepy. Then, we were taught in a classroom with a screen, a projector; that's how they lectured us. Well, I tell people, for eight weeks I was a 'dumb Indian,' an 'idiot,' and some other �Page 9of9 Afto..- ts ~rarlna+1·on 1 bu"d "'"ill"'" On+ +l-..,+ nrnc, vvu~ O" 1v .p,....,. 1· ah+ nr.c>olrs uu 1., a11+l-.at r>hang d that'" nrhat vv tell these people. I'm not hot0headed ... I can take it (I took a lot of them). J.J_U, J. \..I~ • .J..IU.L, l,UJU,l, J.J.J.J .l.VJ. 0 V b 1-L VVVVJ."-- • LVJ. L J_ l,J..l. \..IJ..l J.J. 0 V .•• J_ ~ I experienced the military and the boarding school, but that other stuff about Ignacio is just hearsay; I didn't experience it myself People talked about it and I listened to them. Of course, when I was a little guy I didn't listen. I didn't think it was really important. But today, I would k11ow ifl had listened. I didn't do what I was supposed to ... I feel guilty. I though all the people I k11ew and saw were all still going to be alive, forever. That's the way I perceived it. All the people that I had contact with, I thought they were going to be around forever. I thought everything was going to be the same. Come to find out, they're gone. *** Interviewed by Michael G. Miller, VISTA worker, on January 30th, 2004. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Michael Miller Interviews Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/CNE/1.0/ Date Created Date of creation of the resource. 2003-2004 Subject The topic of the resource Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Description An account of the resource Collection of twelve biographies written by VISTA worker Michael G. Miller of prominent people in the Ignacio community. Based on interviews conducted by Miller between December 9, 2003 and March 15, 2004. Some contain the additional attribution "for the Ignacio Historical Society." Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Miller, Michael G. Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Neil Cloud Biography Date Created Date of creation of the resource. 2004-01-30 Subject The topic of the resource Cloud, Neil; Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Description An account of the resource Biography of Neil Cloud written by VISTA worker Michael Miller and based on an interview conducted by Miller on January 30, 2004. Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Cloud, Neil Extent The size or duration of the resource. 9 pages https://voicesofignacio.cvlcollections.org/files/original/ef9747f447c50d48e2f9c7fde6dd017e.pdf 62ec3c749fcbae27664d373f5db4f14d PDF Text Text Pearl E. Casias (Southern Ute Tribal Elder) My name is Pearl Emily Casias, and I was born on the Southern Ute Indian Reservation in the old Tribal Affairs building. At the time that I was born in the 40s it was called Taylor Hospital. It closed in 1957; it was a Bureau oflndian Affairs hospital. I was raised by my grandparents: Martha Tree and Felipe Lucero. We lived on an 80-acre allotment approximately two miles north of here [Ignacio]. At the time that I was growing up I recall the streets in Ignacio were gravel. There wasn't any pavement and there were gutters on the sides of the roads. But, it was an interesting community. We had a pool hall, and I recall my grandparents going to dances on the weekends at about four places that they used to have dances. So, t must have been a community thing to have social dances well before I was born and during the time that I was growing up. What is now the Ignacio School District bus garage used to be a dance hall. The kitchen appliance warehouse on Main Street was called Rebus Hall-they used to have dances there. It belonged to Mr. Rebus. Then, they had dances at what is now the Head Start building (it used to be the Ute Vocational School), and on some weekends they would have dances in the gym. After they built the T.P. Lounge, they used to have dances in there, also. So, there were four places where people could go to the dances. Most of the community, and from the outlying communities, would come and they would socialize with each other. Some of the tribal members had bands, so they played for one dance hall or another. Occasionally my grandparents would take me, but it wasn't very often. My grandmother would meet with some of the ladies who lived in La Boca and out in the Allison/Tiffany area. So, it was a social dance, but it was also a chance to meet with old friends and, possibly, to make new friends. I was telling an individual that had moved into this area back in the 70s, that I remember walking to Ignacio with my grandparents or with my aunt because we didn't have transportation. In the summer we'd walk, we'd walk two miles. Sometimes on our way back we'd catch a ride with someone who was going our way and they'd drop us off In the fall and during the winter my grandfather would go on the horse to get groceries, or he'd make arrangements with some of the neighbors and he'd ride into town with them. In the spring and early summer my grandparents would ride horses into town and we'd ride with them. We brought empty flour sacks or gunny sacks, put the groceries in them, then put them on the horses for the ride back. I remember the road 516 (that's the road I live on)-it goes from Highway 172 all the way to Bayfield-it was a gravel road. But, County Road 517 that comes right here in front of the Tribal Building it was just a dirt road. It didn't have gravel. After it rained and the people who had cars went over it, it became packed down. So, it was a lot of fun to take your shoes off and walk on the dirt road. There was a theater in Ignacio; it was called the Ute Theater. It's an empty building and an empty lot right now between the Sidekick Lounge and where a real estate office used to be. Mr. And Mrs. Preston (he was a farmer and drove a milk truck for the dairy farmers around the area) ran the theater with their family at night. I remember we'd come down after my grandfather bought a car-we'd come down on the weekends. My grandfather liked Westerns, so we got to see a lot of Westerns. It was real interesting, because you could buy a bag of popcorn �Page 2 of5 for 10 cents and a soda for a nickel. But, you know, those days are long gone. I go to the movies occasionally and for eight dollars you can get a large bag of popcorn and a soda. That's a far cry from the 15 cents for popcorn and a soda. Yeah, things have really changed economically and, I guess, the whole atmosphere of the small town. It's grown quite a bit. I remember they had two dress shops: part of one of the dress shops is part of the grocery store (the Shur-Value) and it also used to be a cafe. There's a place on Main Street called Nuuciu Bible Worship Church, I guess it's called, and that used to be a dress shop. Then, we had a drug store, which was a nice place to go. They had a soda jerk who wore white pants, a white jacket, and a white hat. His name was Mr. Brits; he worked behind the soda fountain and his wife worked on the dry goods side of the drug store. It was fun to go in there. I remember seeing the little soda table, or the little tables, and they had wrought iron chairs. They had stools at the counter, and you could get milkshakes, chocolate malt, or real ice cream (it wasn't ice milk or whatever). So, it was fun coming to town. I remember the bank: Ignacio State Bank. It was run by the Turners, and they lived a block behind the bank. Suzie Turner was Mr. Tuner's wife, and she was a very good friend of my grandmother's. She helped her balance her checkbook. It was fun going into the bank, because people knew each other by first names and it was very 'neighborly,' for lack of a better word. I remember Mrs. Turner was more than happy to help my grandmother, because my grandmother had a checking account. That was real interesting, because !didn't know of too many tribal members that had bank accounts. So, I always thought of my grandmother as being more progressive than some of the tribal members that I knew. A lot of the tribal elders that were her age or older preferred to speak in the Ute language. It was interesting to sit around and listen to what stories they had to tell. When we'd come to town my grandfather would visit with some of his friends, and my grandmother would sit in the grocery store and visit with some of her friends. So, it was real interesting to listen to their stories. It was a whole different era where children were seen and not heard. That was one of the things that we learned when we were growing up. But, Ignacio has gone through quite a change. For as long as I can remember Lawrence Wiseman owned the hardware store, and as he got older his son, Tom, took over. Saul Padia used to work for him, and Saul's wife used to work at the bank as a teller. She was very accommodating for all the people who came into the bank; she was a very nice person. I think Nelly Price was Postmistress when I was very young, and then later on Mr. Pierson became Postmaster. I grew up knowing them as U.S. Postal workers. Mr. Jones owned The Ignacio Chieftain and The Bay.field Blaze. He was the editor of the newspaper, and his shop was where the Dancing Spirit Gallery is today. The pool hall was right next door to The Chieftain office (or the print shop). It was owned by Dan Velasquez. Mr. Lopez (I can't remember his first name) used to manage the pool hall. When you walked into the pool hall there were pinball machines in the front and there was a freezer, so they sold ice cream cones. It was like a convenience store. You could buy canned goods, soda pop, bread, canned lunchmeats, and pork and beans-things like that. And, there was a dividing half; it didn't go all the way up to the ceiling, and behind that were the pool tables and �Page 3 of5 they had some card tables. They apparently played poker and had interesting card games back there. I remember when we were growing up my brother was a pinball fanatic. He always made outstanding scores in the pinball machine game. So, he hung out at the pool hall a lot just to play the pinball machines. And, of course, my grandfather liked to play cards a lot, so he'd take my brother and they'd go to the pool hall together. I have three children: I have two girls and a son. My oldest daughter works part-time. My son works at the casino; he's been there since before we remodeled and it became a casino. He worked in the restaurant before being converted to work in the casino. So, when he went to work in the casino he worked in 'The Cage', and he's been there for 10 years. He worked in the restaurant for about 14 years before that, so he's been working there for 14, going on 15, years. My youngest daughter works in Durango with the Tierra Group, with the Growth Fund. I had an older brother. He died when I was 16. My mother remarried-she divorced my father-so I had a half-brother, and he died two years ago. I don't have any other brothers and sisters. I just have my children and grandchildren. I have five grandchildren: four granddaughters and one grandson. My parents are deceased and, of course, my grandparents are gone, too. I just lost my aunt three years ago; it'll be four years this summer. So, I'm pretty much the matriarch of my family. I tell my children about the way things were when I was growing up. I've seen a lot of changes. Like I was saying, that family that came to live here, I would tell them that I used to walk to town. He'd say, 'Oh no, people already had cars' and 'That's impossible.' So, I would say, 'It might seem impossible to you, but things on the reservation were slower than in mainstream America.' It was in '54 and '55 that we finally had a water-well dug. We finally got running water and electricity and propane. So, it was the mid50s when we finally got the modem conveniences. It's interesting, because my brother and I both grew up hauling water and wood chips, and he had to bring in coal. As soon as we got home from school we changed our clothes and were busy until dinnertime. Then we had other chores, and then we had time for homework. You know, a couple of weeks ago (when there was a cold spell) my water pipes froze. You go from having no conveniences to the conveniences of today and then, all of a sudden, you can't tum on the tap water because the pipes are frozen. And, you think, 'How did I survive before?' I remember going to town after Halloween, and a lot of the townspeople had outdoor facilities, they didn't have running water. There were two places in town to get water. In one section of town all of the people would go over to where the elementary school is. There was a water pump there. So, they got their water there. And, I think, there was a water faucet at the other end of town. There were two places in town where you could get running water. The townspeople also burned wood and coal. After Halloween most of the outhouses had been turned over. Kids would pull tricks and turn over the outhouses. (Must have been chaos during that time!) I think it was during the early to mid-60s that the authors of Native American Programs made grants to rural communities. That's what provided the possibility of the town to receive funding so that they could put in gutters and sidewalks. I think it was in the late 50s, some time during the 50s, that they paved the roads. It's just been recently that progress has come to Ignacio. I think the Tribe has provided a lot of benefits to the community. Having grown up in �Page 4 of5 the community and with children from the two other ethnic groups, you develop friendships. So, the people that live here, I fell, have good relationships simply because they live here. Who knows? Maybe it's just the people that come here that change the atmosphere of a small town setting. I can walk down the street today and½ or¾ of the people I do not know. Of course, there're still the people that I know, who I grew up with. So, the community goes through some changes. During the summer they have the San Ignacio Fiesta at the end of July. It's to honor the patron saint: Saint Ignatius. What I remember when I was a little girl, we'd go to the church services and some of the tribal members would go and they'd help prepare the feast. The Indians and the Hispanics would have this big feast. We'd have what you would consider a huge potluck dinner. There was no charge. The tribal members would provide some of the supplies for this dinner. Some of the tribal men would assist in the cooking and what have you. Everyone would sit down and eat together, and they'd have games in the afternoon and Indian dancing. Some of the tribal elder men would come and they'd drum and sing for some of the young people. And, the young men would perform war dances. Everybody just king of got along together. I enjoyed taking part in the community. Then, in the fall, the Tribe would put on, and we still do (I think it's the 84th) Ute Fair. And, that's for tribal members. They'd have games for adults and children, alike. They'd have a baseball game, tug of war (women against women or men against women). It was a lot of fun to watch, and a lot of the tribal members participated. They brought all of their agricultural produce, livestock, and poultry. I saw turkeys, and rabbits, and chickens. I don't think I saw any guineas. The Tribe would provide prizes for First, Second, and Third. They'd have a big rodeo, and just recently they've started have a huge powwow. So it's kind of gone through an evolution. It's been interesting to see the evolution from what it was then to what it is today-it's dramatically different. Everybody came for the entries: from the west side to the east side of the reservation. They'd get people to come in from the community to judge the arts and crafts, the sewing, the canning, the livestock and poultry, and what have you. They'd have horse races and, like I said, a rodeo-everybody would participate in the rodeo. It's quite different from what it used to be; it's gone through a lot of changes. I remember we had a tribal member that was like the Chief of Police for quite a few years, and he worked really well with the Town Marshall. When we became teenagers we had some friends who owned cars; they came from middle class families, I guess. So, we'd ride around with our friends. There weren't any streetlights in Ignacio when I was a teenager. So, we'd turn the lights off on the car and play 'cat and mouse' with the Town Marshall. They would chase us around through the alleys. It was harmless; we weren't involved in vandalism or destruction of anybody's property. It was just playing 'cat and mouse' with the Town Marshall. I'm sure he knew who we were and the kid who owned the vehicle. They, for some reason, never did catch up with us. I went to school here at the Ute Vocational School until I was in the fifth grade. The Ute Vocational School was both boarding school and day school. Some of us were day school students and we were bussed. The Indian students that came from the Navajo Reservation and the Ute Mountain or Northern Ute Reservations stayed in the dorms. Those ofus that lived here were bussed to the school, and in the evening we rode home on the bus. �Page 5 of5 When I was promoted to the sixth grade, I asked my grandmother if I could go to Ignacio Elementary (I wanted to see what it was like to be in a public school). So I went and I enjoyed it. The following year, when I was promoted to the seventh grade, the schools in Ignacio were consolidated. The school closed down and all of the students went to the public school. So, even though they were boarding school students they went to the public schools. The Ute Vocational School became the Junior High School. It was a joint school. That's why it's called "' 'TI-JT So~ they urillzed ute-Ybcatibfial School for fue Junlor H{gii Sclro6lt ?111, 8th,., atl1ci 9111 grades. All of the elementary students went to Ignacio Elementary, and the high school students were in Ignacio High School. Because of the increase in students (because of the school district becoming joint) they received more funding from the State. They built a new high school. It benefited not only the Indian students it also benefited the district. That happened in '57. me At that time they also closed down the hospital. The government gave the hospital to the Tribe. And, so, the Tribe remodeled the building and converted it into offices. That's where we were located until last fall when they finished this building [the Leonard C. Burch Tribal Affairs Building]. My grandmother was Ute and my grandfather was Hispanic. When we were growing up we learned to speak Ute; that was our first language. Our second language was Spanish. When I went to school (I went to school when I was six years old) I couldn't speak English. Of course, my brother learned to speak English (he was two years older than I), because he was in the third grade when I started school. We carried on a tri-lingual conversation. When we'd get home from school my grandmother would speak to us in Ute, my grandfather would speak o us in Spanish, and we'd respond in English. So, they became familiarized with the English language. They could both speak English, but they weren't fluent or proficient. The more we learned the more they learned. (My grandmother was fluent in Spanish.) It's interesting: the first time I filled out an employment application, I said I speak one foreign language and that's English. Most people chuckle when they read my application or my resume and they see I speak a foreign language: English. Interviewed by Michael G. Miller (VISTA worker) on January 13, 2004. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Michael Miller Interviews Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/CNE/1.0/ Date Created Date of creation of the resource. 2003-2004 Subject The topic of the resource Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Description An account of the resource Collection of twelve biographies written by VISTA worker Michael G. Miller of prominent people in the Ignacio community. Based on interviews conducted by Miller between December 9, 2003 and March 15, 2004. Some contain the additional attribution "for the Ignacio Historical Society." Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Miller, Michael G. Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Pearl Casias Biography Date Created Date of creation of the resource. 2004-01-13 Subject The topic of the resource Casias, Pearl; Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Description An account of the resource Biography of Pearl Casias written by VISTA worker Michael Miller and based on an interview conducted by Miller on January 13, 2004. Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Casias, Pearl Extent The size or duration of the resource. 5 pages https://voicesofignacio.cvlcollections.org/files/original/780577d48ff6c3d8c6950dd6b0bb9c4b.pdf 133c6b07a045355ce33e1732063723f5 PDF Text Text Russell Box, Sr. (Southern Ute Tribal Elder) My name is Russell Box, Sr. I was born here in Ignacio in 1935 where the old tribal building is. They called it Taylor Hospital at that time. The time when I was born was when most of the tribal members were still traveling on horseback. So, when I was growing up, before I went to school, a lot of the people who were visiting would bring a lot of-excitementto the family, because we were kind of isolated: W-e didn't live close together. S-o, if a family member traveled from La Boca clear up to Bayfield, it was a real treat for all ofus. The whole family was enthused about it, because ifwe knewa family member traveled from as far away as La Boca that meant that the person would stay overnight. Us kids were excited because we thought maybe we would hear stories from what the elders were talking about. Our grandmother was the one who told us that when someone was speaking we were not to say anything. When they came to visit, we had to be on our best: notte be rude, not to talk. A lot of these things seem to have dissipated now. Young people do not listen, and they don't seem to honor their parents and their grandparents. A lot of the elders that came to visit- a lot of their stories were oral, and were passed down to all of us. They were stories that would help us in our lives: how to canyon; how we should conduct ourselves. When I got to the age of six, I was taken to the boarding school down at the Agency. And, that was my first experience -of-going to school. · Atthe time-that I went to schooH did not speak English, I just spoke in the Ute language. The boys' dormitory was a two-story building. My first experience entering-that building felt like I was -entering a big tunnel because -of its long hallways. That first or second evening a lot of the young kids were taken down into the basement, down below ground level, and the older boys were given the authority to cut the little boys' hair. So, a lot ofus gathered around and everything was exciting, because of the lights and the water. Things that we saw-there were totally different for us. Back home-we ha-d-t-o -carry-our water from the spring for the household. That meant washing the dishes, to take a bath, and to wash our clothes. There was no -electric or butane stove~everything had to be taken care of. The older people had to chop the wood, and us kids had to bring the wood into the house. So, it was the young people's duty to bring those things in: the water, the wood, and even to start the wood stove. When the older people went to the store on the wagon to get groceries, it was our job to get the water and wood in and·to·have the wood stove burning by the time they got back in the evening, which was about four or five o'clock. We didn't have time, didn't have a clock in the house, but we kind of went by the wn. -So; when they got home-they didn 'thave to do ·all of that-it was in there in the house: All they had to do was start the cooking. My grandmother used to say if you want to eat you've-gotto do-all of these things. When I was in school we were excited about all these things that we saw: there was a washbasin, toilets, you'd step on a lever and the water would come out. To-us;·these wer-ethingsthatwe never experienced before. When we went down to the basement, the older boys told us what kind of haircut we wanted. At that time we didn't know that-theywer-e jokingwithus. So,·when we told them we wanted our hair to be cut a certain way is when they cut our hair completely off. Us young kids were traumatized. We didn't knowthe diff-erenrewhethefihey used hand clippers Of ,dect-ric -dipperS. �--------------- -------------------------- Page 2 of9 So, all of us, us young kids at the age of six, were all crying because her-ewe were-we had lost all of our hair. After that was done to us we were told to strip our clothes down, to get in the shower. We didn't have no privacy, everybody was all together. After we had our shower and dried off, they put powder on us. I guess a lot of this was for hygiene-some ofus kids had lice. Since we were young we didn't understand what wa-s-happening to us. Even going to the bathroom was kind of funny, because we'd sit on the bowl, and we were taught how to tear the toilet paper. Some ofus never had indoor-toilets, w to-flu-sh the-t-oilet we wtmdered wher-e it all went. So, some of-those things were good to experience and some of it bothered us in some way or another, especially when you tlidn'tknowhowtospeak in English. The first few months that we went to school a lot of us didn't know how to speak English. A few of us ~w some words, but some -of us totally did not understand. ·A lot -of-us didn't know how to say, 'I have to go to the bathroom.' So, some ofus had accidents in the classrooms. Where we slept, in the dormitory, there were about 60 kids. We had closets, but we had to share the closet with somebody else-maybe 3 or 4 persons. Notoniythat,-we-hadtoi:eamirow to make our own bed; how to take the mattress cover off; how to fold the sheets on the bed. When you are at age six that-is-something to experience. But, akogether, the dormitory life was good. And at that time I didn't know how good I had it, because at the boarding school, everything that we had was fresh. -We had fresh milk from the-dairy cows. We-had-a-gar-denihat a lot of the young students took care of during the spring and in the fall. We had a big cellar there where things were put after being harvested so that we could have fresh -things-during-the winter months. They had chickens, so we had eggs. We had milk, we had beef, and they had a bakery there. We had to learn how to make bread so that the students could have bread to eat. For some reason or another some ofus wanted to run away, we wanted to go back home. Some ofus lived about 10 miles away, 5 miles, or less than that. I remember there were several Navajo kids who lived with us, ho came all the way from Nageezi, Shiprock, or Farmington. And there were some Ute kids who came from Towoac. Sometimes we had arguments or got into a fight, or something like that. But, the majority of the time it was controlled real good. In the boys dormitory there maids were the ones who took care of our clothing-sorted them out. They sewed our clothes. Some ofus didn't have enough clothes at that time, so the government issued us cover alls. It was sort of like a jump suit: it had buttons down the middle, from the collar all the way down. So, when you had to go to the bathroom you had to unbutton all of the buttons to take off the top part and then sit down. We had to be in bed at about 6:00 in the evening. During the summer we were in bed when the sun was still going down. We had to get up, I would say, about 6:00 in the morning. We had to do our detail: make our bed, wash up before going to breakfast, and then wait until the buzzer rang. When the buzzer rang we all lined up to go to the dining room. Everything was like a military way. When I first experienced the dining room there were a lot of tables there. When we sat down to eat, most of the food was served at the table. A lot of us young kids did not eat good, because the older boys would take most of the food that was there. A lot ofus kids cried because we didn't get something that we were supposed to get. They did have prayer: everybody stood up for a minute or two and then sat down to eat. There was no certain way we were told to do it, �Page 3 of9 we were just told to do this. As the years went by those things started to change. Instead of the food being served at the table, they had cafeteria style. All of the students that went to the boarding school had to fix their bed, brush their teeth, and comb their hair. We had to take a shower two times a week, and our bedding had to be changed once a week. The rooms were always warm in the winter time-we had plenty of heat. I did that for 12 years in the boarding school. As we got older we participated in sports: played football, basketball, baseball. In fact, when I was at school there we had the best gym in all of La Plata County. I remember Ignacio had a gym, in fact, I think it's still there. I think they turned it into some type of garage now. Its ceilings were real low. Most of the schools we played had decent places to play basketball. But, over the years some of things began to change, too. I remember Bayfield: Bayfield had a gym on the second floor of a building on Main Street there. That's changed, too. We played with local schools in this area: Pagosa, Bayfield, Dove Creek, and we even went down to Gallup to play with some of the Native students there. And, they had tournaments for basketball and baseball. They had the regular season and they had tournaments. I guess a lot of this was to keep the students busy, so that we wouldn't get into trouble. The doors of the boys' dormitory were not locked at night. You could open the door to go outside, but it was locked when you tried to get back in. Some of us, trying to be ornery or just to experience something, would go out into the night. I remember there were some houses close to the dormitory, and I think they had raspberries. So one time some ofus went out at night, and crawled around their gardens picking and eating raspberries. But, before we did that we put rock at the bottom of the doorway, so that when we came back we could get back inside. If not, or if we made a mistake, we had to scratch on the window so that one of the kids would open the door for us. A lot of the roads in this area at that time were not paved. They were all dirt roads. When I was little, when we had snowstorms, I remember my grandfather would put skis on the wagon wheels. I remember playing down by the Agency, which is close to the Bear Dance grounds, and a lot ofus kids would go to the river, which would freeze to about an inch thick. But, we don't see that now. A lot ofus would play games on the ice using sticks and rocks for hockey. When I was in school I didn't know what Christmas was. When we were in school they would start decorating maybe a month or two weeks before Christmas-decorating the classrooms with ornaments. It was exciting to a lot ofus, because we didn't understand. In the gym they had tall Christmas trees that almost went clear up to the ceiling. I remember the first Christmas tree I saw in the gym was lit by candles-they didn't have lights. They lit the candles at certain times, as long as there was someone there to watch them. As time went by that changed, too. They got lights and started to decorate differently. The students would have parts in the Christmas play. Even when we had movies in the gym, they were always held in the evening. The movies were on Friday evenings, and some of the parents would come on horseback to come see the movies. I remember my grandmother coming to see a movie one time, and I think that was the only time she came. A lot of the parents, during the summer or during the fall, would camp along the river if they came to visit their children. I was a long ways home for them to go in the evening. �Page 4 of9 School would open in September. Some of us were fortunate that our parents cam after us during the Christmas holidays. Most ofus who didn't go home for the Christmas holidays stayed in the dormitories for Christmas. I think it was in the middle of May that school was over, and the school would always have some kind of game like baseball or softball, or hand games before we had our picnic. After that, if your parents were there fore the picnic you would go home. So, we went back home in the summer for three months. When you were small three months was a long, long time. It's not like when you are older and time goes by quicker. So, you might say I've seen a lot of change here. The roads: a lot of the roads are paved now. The side roads, I call them, or county roads are better maintained. You've got barred ditches that are maintained by the road department-some of them taken care ofby the County, some of them by the BIA So, there are a lot of changes that have happened, and a lot of experiences that we've had. When I was growing up, my grandfather died, and I didn't see the burial and the funeral. When I s~y my grandfather, at the time I didn't realize that he wasn't my real grandfather. My real grandfather passed on, maybe before I was even born. His name was Jacob, and my grandmother's name was Bertha. So, you might say, that the Southern Utes here are sort of all related to each other through marriage and through our relatives. After my grandfather passed on, I do not know how long afterwards, but my grandmother passed on. I was taken out of school and brought to one of grandmother's houses. She was there sick, but I do not know how long she had been sick. I guess she wanted to see the grandchildren. I remember being there and we went into the kitchen where she laid next to the stove in her bed. They talked to her and she didn't respond. You could tell that she was breathing; maybe she was in a coma or something. They told us kids to go outside and play. Later on, maybe an hour or two later, was when we heard the crying in the house. So, they called us kids to come into the house. The traditional way when someone passed on you would have to step over that person's body. At that time I didn't understand why they did that. I guess you might say they did that because she was an elder: you stepped over the person to honor that person. Some of these traditions are still carried on by some ofus, but not always. Like I said: there are a lot of things that have changed. When people were buried they didn't have coffins. At that time the person was wrapped, someone would dig the hole, and the body would be lowered into the hole. Now we've got all of these expensive coffins. But, when I was going to school (after my grandmother died) it seems like all of my relatives-my uncles and my aunts-it seemed like we all scattered. The reason why I say that is because my grandmother was the one who held us all together. And, when she passed on it seemed like we all started wandering around. We did not live in the same place when I was raised-we kind of moved around and lived with different relatives. I remember my aunt went into Durango and got a job there. I want to say I was about six or seven, maybe seven or eight, years old when we went over there. She got a job there at the COD laundry. I think the First National Bank is there now. It's up by the Durango High School. There used to be a COD laundry that burned down. Since she didn't have the money to rent a house, we lived in a tent down by the river; where the old fire plant is. They called it "Swinging Bridge" in Durango; that's where we lived. We lived there in the summertime. From the railroad tracks (the Narrow Gauge) to the Animas Rive there was hardly �Page 5 of9 anything: no buildings (like the Town Square) and all those buildings in that area now. Maybe a month later, or two weeks later, she told me to go back to Ignacio to pick up my mother and my cousin. So, I experienced the Narrow Gauge, because the Narrow Gauge used to run through Ignacio, La Boca, and I think Arboles, Pagosa, all the way clear to Colorado Springs. I went from Durango to Ignacio, and I was between six and seven years old when they put me on the train. I walked from the train depot south oflgnacio almost half way to Bayfield. That's a lot of responsibility for a young man, but I did it. When I got to the house, where my grandmother lived, I told my mother we were going and I told my cousin we better get ready for the next day to go back to Durango. Early the next morning we left the house on foot. We're not talking about taxi service, we're not talking about horseback. Because, at that time, there was hardly any people who had cars. We had no phone to call somebody and say, 'Can you take me here or there.' But, we walked roughly, I want to say, from today's Sun Dance ground-about three miles north of the Agency. You might say, altogether, from the train depot up to where we lived was maybe five miles. As soon as we got there we bought the tickets, and as soon as we bought the tickets here comes the train. It was about 1:00, so it took us all morning to walk there. We got off at the train depot in Durango, which is still there. They use it for the Narrow Gauge up to Silverton. From there we went along the railroad tracks until I knew where to tum and go down by the nver. There were a lot of little houses that were along the Animas Valley at that time, by the river. They were mostly Spanish people. Their houses were little frame houses. All those things are gone now. So that was one experience. And, the other experience-I don't remember how old I was, maybe eight-my aunt decided to go to Albuquerque. She had gotten a job there. So, the following summer when school was out we went to Albuquerque. That was the first time, you might say, that I really left the reservation. We got on the bus right at the BIA building. I remember the times it used to stop in Ignacio, in Bayfield, just about anywhere you would want it to stop. From there we went to Durango, from Durango we went to Albuquerque. As we were going to Albuquerque it seemed like the bus stopped at every trading post, every little town or whatever it was down to Albuquerque. By the time we left from here at 8:00 in the morning we arrived in Albuquerque about 4 or 5:00 in the evening. And, the highway from here down to there wasn't the way it is today. It was paved, but it was a very narrow two lane, and it had a lot of curves in it. Even Albuquerque has changed. When I first went to Albuquerque it was only two lanes, and now they've go t all those freeways there. Going back to Durango ... When we were kids, we wandered around in Durango-all over the place. In fact, we went on top of where the present Fort Lewis is now. There was nothing up there. There was a small airport and a large lake of some kind. There was no college up there at that time. I remember one summer, you might say, we did just about anything to make money. We collected boxes, we collected milk bottles and even iron ... metal, so that we could go to the movies. They had several movie houses in Durango at that time. Most it's gone now. Anyway, those are the things we did when we were kids. I remember one time we decided to go to 3rd Street, and that was considered to be upper call at that time., There was about four ofus, and we went from house to house asking if we could cut their grass, clean their yard, whatever. I remember one time a lady was telling us what to do. She had one of those push mowers; it �Page 6 of9 wasn't an electric or gas mower like you have today. One of the lids was doing that, someone else was raking, and the rest ofus did what the lady wanted us to. She was an elderly lady. So, when we were through, we collected all of the things that we used and put them into the garage. As we were in the garage, she had boxes of stuff all over the garage. To us, it was kind of exciting, because we saw all kinds of things in the garage. We saw boxes of comics, magazines, tools and stuff like that. One of us saw a box there, and we opened the lid. We saw that there cigars in it. I don't remember who started it, but one of us started taking the cigars and sticking them in our pockets. We didn't get caught doing that, and we got paid on top of it. Instead of going to another job, because we had the cigars in our pockets, we headed down to the river. There were four ofus sitting there down by the bank and we all lit up! We didn't even finish our cigars! · I mean, we got to where we were all green-our colors were changing. I remember we threw all of our cigars in the river. So, when my aunt came back from work my cousin was sick, and she wanted to know why he was sick. But, we weren't going to tell her. I just wanted to tell you that we roamed Durango. I remember the streetlights in Durango would tum off as soon as the sun went down. No stores were open-nothing like that. In other words, 'they rolled the sidewalk up' -that's what we used to say. Ft. Lewis wasn't there. The Narrow Gauge was there, but it was only used to transport people to certain areas. After Ft. Lewis came, the Narrow Gauge became more of a tourist attraction. When I went to Albuquerque, we lived on First Street. Central was the main drag, and, you might say, First Street was where all of the bars and lower class were. That's where we were. My aunt used to give us money and tell us to go get food to eat. When we were at the boarding school we had good food. But, during the summer months there wasn't enough food for everybody. So, each day, when we were in Albuquerque, we walked Central one block at a time. The first day we walked one block, then back to the hotel. The next day we walked two blocks. We walked until we went from First Street all the way to the park. When we saw the park we thought we were in heaven, because there were trees and grass there. So, I took my mother and my cousin's sister to that area to have a little picnic. Then, a month later (I can't remember) we moved to another area in Albuquerque on 4th Street they called, up by the Indian school. My aunt had rented a house up there. We didn't have indoor plumbing. We had only a faucet in there, and there was one bed in that house: a spring bed. So, when we got there we threw our coats and our clothes on the bed so we could have something to lie on. Now you can tell how poor we were. We got to know the kids in that area. After we got acquainted with them we started roaming the area. We went to Central, the zoo, the Rio Grande, all on foot, or if we had the money, by bus. Even Albuquerque has changed. By the time I went to school in 1941, and experienced all of that clear up to the 11 th grade, I went to Santa Fe (to go to the boarding school there). The reason for that was I was in Albuquerque at the hospital; where I had a hernia repair. There were a lot of kids already in school, and when I was out of the hospital I was going to try to go to school in Albuquerque. But, the administration said I couldn't attend, because I think, at that time, it was only open for the Navajo kids. They told me that maybe I would try Santa Fe. I took the bus from �Page 7 of9 Albuquerque to Santa Fe and got off at the school. I went to the administration there, and they told me they were going to take me in. They told me to go to the boys' dormitory and check in. I had just had surgery done on me and the suitcase was real heavy for me. I was struggling with my suitcase with my suitcase, and I remember one young man came and asked if he could carry my suitcase for me. He carried it to the dormitory. I met the boys' supervisor, and they told me they would get me a room as soon as I went to eat dinner. So, I walked down the sidewalk with some of the guys and I didn't know anybody. Because I was a newcomer, everybody was looking at me. They gave me a room with three other guys. So, that was my experience there for the first time. I was there for nine months, and while I was in Santa Fe I had to report to the probation officer down there. Because, I had gotten into trouble in Bayfield when I was a young man. I think I was like 13 or 14 years old when it happened. So, I went to school down there, and it was different because there were a lot more kids than in Ignacio. I learned a lot about Santa Fe and how that school ran. I kind of liked it, because when you were in grade school they taught you different trades: carpentry, farming, things like that. Some of the boys even got involved with home economics: learned how to cook, how to take care of your room. I guess they were preparing you for when you left the boarding school. In the senior year you pick a trade that you want, and that's the reason why I liked Santa Fe. But, I did not go back the following year, which was my senior year. I went back to Ignacio. We graduated; I want to say safely, with only 10 seniors in our class. And, I'm sitting here today thinking to myself, 'How many of those kids are still here, are still with us?' The only thing I can say is there are maybe three ofus left from that class. After going through all that (experiencing the BIA boarding school and learning to speak English), I don't think I went to many ceremonies. The only ceremony I remember from when I was small was the Bear Dance. Going back to before I went to school, my grandmother took me to the Sun Dance. And, that was the last time I saw that particular ceremony until I was between 14 and 16, when I saw the Sun Dance come back. After graduation, a lot ofus went into Durango to go into the service, to enlist. Because of my probation-trouble with the law-they couldn't take me. So, I went to Haskell Institute, in Lawrence, KS, for a post-graduate trade school. I was there for nine months and took auto mechanics (that was my major). I got into trouble there, too. (I didn't learn how to get out of trouble.) So, I stayed in jail there for a while. When I got out of jail, I went back to school. But, school was already closing by that time. So, I took my suitcase and, with one of my buddies, went to Kansas City, MO, which is just on the other side of the river. We looked for a job over there, and I guess we didn't have good luck. I was running out of money, so I asked my buddy about going back to Ignacio. I found some money here, and instead of staying around, we went to Chicago. So, we got a bus ticket all the way to Chicago. We finally made it to Chicago (it took us maybe two or three days), and we got a room at the YMCA (close to the "Loop," they called it). I guess they called it the "Loop", because the train went in a loop through the heart of Chicago. �Page 8 of9 We started looking for a job and went to the employment agency. We finally got a job several miles from there (south of Chicago). Our job was at a hardware store. We stayed at the YMCA, so everyday we had to wake up, eat a small breakfast, and ride the subway. So, that was another experience: riding the subway. It goes under the ground then above the ground. Our job there was to police the area: pick up trash and sweep the area. That was our first job, and it took us a couple of days to do that. Our second job was to sort all of the lumber. That's when I learned how long a piece was just by looking at it. We had the tape with us, and they told us to sort them out into separate piles: lx4s, lx6s ... Then, when someone came with an order we had to fill that order: put everything on a big truck (flatbed)-lumber, cement, plywood, whatever was in that order. It got to where it didn't take us very long to get certain items and put them on the delivery truck. I remember twice a month we had to go to the train yard with the flatbed. The man that was with us knew the number of the boxcars that we had to break the seal, open the sliding doors, and unload the lumber onto the flatbed. We then delivered it to the lumberyard and sorted it out. We were there for three or four months. (I was 18 at that time.) So, that was another experience away from the reservation. All of those places that we went to on the bus: there were no freeways there. When we were in Chicago, they were just starting to do some of the suburbs. That was between 1954 and whatever. After we did our thing up there, school was going to open again. So, I thought I had a chance to go back to school. When we came back to Lawrence, KS, we went to the administration and informed them that we were coming back to school then. They denied me of coming back in. But my friend, who was with me, they accepted him back into school. So, he asked me what I'm going to do, and I told him I'd find our later. He checked in, and I left campus, went back to Lawrence, KS; I guess a mile or two away. I got a room; I went to eat, went to my room and went to sleep. The next day I bought a bus ticket and went back to Kansas City, MO. So, I got a hotel room and the first day I just kind of wandered around the town. The next day I checked out ofmy room and asked if there was a YMCA close by. I walked over there with my suitcase (to the YMCA), checked in, and they gave me a room. I asked the people at the YMCA if there was any training for auto mechanics, and they told me where to go. I went in there, signed up for enrollment, and the next day I asked them if they could help me get a job. The classes were 6:00-10:00 at night, so during the day you needed some kind of job. They sent me to a couple of jobs, but they didn't hire me. The third job I went to they hired me. It was to do upholstery on automobiles. What you do is, when a vehicle comes in, you take all of the old seat covers off, and the costumers would say, 'I want this kind of seat cover and color.' Our job was to put the new seat covers on. Some people did custom seat covers-that means they did the designing and all the custom style work. It took me a couple of days to get the hang of it, depending on the customer. I did that for eight hours, go back and eat a quick lunch, then go to school from 6-10:00 at night. And, I did that for nine months. Then I came back. I got a letter from the Agency saying I had to come back. So, I quit the school, paid my bills and everything, and came back this way. I took care of the problem I had here, and instead of going back I stuck around here. So, my cousin and me stayed on the farm and helped my aunt and here husband. After a year or two, we both got into trouble and we both couldn't drive. So, I guess we were both down on our luck. �Page 9 of9 We didn't know what to do with ourselves anymore, so we decided to join the service. So, we went over to Durango and passed the test over there. After that our parents took us to Denver to do more tests: physical and written. We both passed with 'flying colors'. The only problem with that was they told me I had to go see someone upstairs, because of my record; that happened when I was 13-14 years old. The man told me, 'I'll sign the waiver if you go back home and have four affidavits signed by four people.' So, I was delayed one week, and my cousin told me he was going to go on. I assumed that we were going to be together for basic, because we both signed the buddy system. So, I came back, got the affidavits, sent them to Denver, and a few days later I got a letter saying for me to come in. That evening I flew to San Antonio, and my cousin went to California. We never saw each other for four years. I was at San Antonio, at boot camp down there for the Air Force. When boot camp was over, I got my orders to go to Las Vegas, NV. I came up here, because I had 15 days of leave before I reported to my next base. And, I was there for two years, I guess. Then I went to the Philippines, South Pacific, and I was there for about two years. I (!Ji,'re.w,W~ {!,,1. ~Vd(.~L 6 \).t-':.,1J'.\, wv<Z.U..~( W1l~«--1 Jtw. Hrli -ZV-CLL) � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Michael Miller Interviews Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/CNE/1.0/ Date Created Date of creation of the resource. 2003-2004 Subject The topic of the resource Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Description An account of the resource Collection of twelve biographies written by VISTA worker Michael G. Miller of prominent people in the Ignacio community. Based on interviews conducted by Miller between December 9, 2003 and March 15, 2004. Some contain the additional attribution "for the Ignacio Historical Society." Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Miller, Michael G. Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Russell Box Sr. Biography Date Created Date of creation of the resource. 2004-01-11 Subject The topic of the resource Box, Russell Sr.; Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Description An account of the resource Biography of Russell Box Sr. written by VISTA worker Michael Miller and based on an interview conducted by Miller on January 11, 2004. Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. Ignacio, Colorado; Southwest Colorado Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Box, Russell Sr. Extent The size or duration of the resource. 9 pages